NON - Should ex-pats be allowed to vote in the UK election?

Tinpot Club said:
UK citizens living abroad = Ex Pats
Foreign citizens living in the UK = Immigrants

Amazing how we have different phrases to describe essentially the same thing. Shows the influence the language of the media has on people.

Since I’m saying these 2 groups are the same then rules should be the same. If we allow British immigrants abroad to vote, overseas expats in the UK should have the same rights and vice versa.
Click to expand...

But they're not the same, it's a bullshit excuse people bring up all the time.

An expat is somebody who is working in another country but intends to go home at some point
An immigrant is somebody who has the intention of permanently residing in the new country
 
The rules are ok as they stand.
  • be registered to vote
  • be 18 or over on the day of the election ('polling day')
  • be a British, Irish or qualifying Commonwealth citizen
  • be resident at an address in the UK (or a British citizen living abroad who has been registered to vote in the UK in the last 15 years)
  • not be legally excluded from voting
Why should I be able to vote in a country I don't live in and have no intention of moving back to.
 
Silent AFCB said:
But they're not the same, it's a bullshit excuse people bring up all the time.

An expat is somebody who is working in another country but intends to go home at some point
An immigrant is somebody who has the intention of permanently residing in the new country
Click to expand...
Why is it not the same. I’ve worked with plenty of EU citizens who have now already gone home or intend to at some point. I myself have lived abroad with the intention of permanently residing there but as my circumstances changed I eventually returned to the UK.

And by your very definitions, how do you describe people who retire to Spain. If they have no intention to move home wouldn’t that make them immigrants?
 
Tinpot Club said:
Why is it not the same. I’ve worked with plenty of EU citizens who have now already gone home or intend to at some point. I myself have lived abroad with the intention of permanently residing there but as my circumstances changed I eventually returned to the UK.

And by your very definitions, how do you describe people who retire to Spain. If they have no intention to move home wouldn’t that make them immigrants?
Click to expand...

Yes, people who move to Spain to live out their days there are immigrants. Al is an immigrant in France, I'm sure he'll agree. EU citizens (or any citizen of any country for that matter) that move to the UK to work but intend to go home are expats, not immigrants.
 
Silent AFCB said:
Yes, people who move to Spain to live out their days there are immigrants. Al is an immigrant in France, I'm sure he'll agree. EU citizens (or any citizen of any country for that matter) that move to the UK to work but intend to go home are expats, not immigrants.
Click to expand...
So basically we agree then.

My frustration is the British media rarely using the term ex-pat to describe temporary EU workers here while would never dream of referring to the retired in Spain as immigrants.
 
Tinpot Club said:
So basically we agree then.

My frustration is the British media rarely using the term ex-pat to describe temporary EU workers here while would never dream of referring to the retired in Spain as immigrants.
Click to expand...
It's a semantic point, to us they would be emigrant, it seems common enough to hear that such and such has emigrated to wherever no?
I've no idea what the Spanish call them, it's probably a bit rude :)
 
Tinpot Club said:
So basically we agree then.

My frustration is the British media rarely using the term ex-pat to describe temporary EU workers here while would never dream of referring to the retired in Spain as immigrants.
Click to expand...

The lines get blurred with EU citizens as our government don't actually know what the score is I guess. With other nationalities filling in a form, I would imagine there's a tick box for whether they plan on eventually gaining citizenship like they do in the US.

I agree the press are terrible at using the correct words in order to sell papers / get clicks.
 
My dad cant vote here any more as he has been in Spain 15 years. He cant vote in Spain either as he is not a Spanish citizen (just has residency). He cant become a Spanish citizen as his Spanish isn't fluent enough.
He can vote in their local elections but not national ones.
 
bruce red said:
My dad cant vote here any more as he has been in Spain 15 years. He cant vote in Spain either as he is not a Spanish citizen (just has residency). He cant become a Spanish citizen as his Spanish isn't fluent enough.
He can vote in their local elections but not national ones.
Click to expand...
15 years in Spain and can't speak the language !!
I think the first thing I would do if I moved to another country is learn to speak their language.
Kiswahili is the native tongue of Kenya, but most speak English too.
Its nice to know what the locals are talking about and you get integrated and excepted into their community much easier.
 
In Finland, if I take citizenship then officials are no longer allowed to deal with me in English at all. As a resident with permanent right to remain, they can. There can be some really complex beaurocratic issues in life and so I'd rather have the option of being able to ensure I'm 100% certain what is happening in a given situation by having a discussion in English as well as Finnish. That doesn't mean I don't speak Finnish or can't take part in conversations with the locals.

My wife is completely fluent in English having lived with me there for about a decade but when faced with some of the UK governments documents to do with tax and so forth couldn't make head nor tail of it and always had to get me to do it.

So there's speaking the language fluently and there's speaking the legalese that official documents come in. That's one of the main reasons why I will never take Finnish citizenship.
 
When I get stopped by the traffic police I always speak English, its very helpful to understand what they are saying in Swahili to each other about how much money they will try and get out of me.
Some of the amounts are so over the top "stupid mzungu with lots of cash" When i start to discuss the problem with them in Swahili, their jaws drop and then they just tell me to drive with a wave of their hand.
 
Kenya Cherrie said:
When I get stopped by the traffic police I always speak English, its very helpful to understand what they are saying in Swahili to each other about how much money they will try and get out of me.
Some of the amounts are so over the top "stupid mzungu with lots of cash" When i start to discuss the problem with them in Swahili, their jaws drop and then they just tell me to drive with a wave of their hand.
Click to expand...

I always found showing then the business card of the police chief worked pretty well ..used to at least bump them down to a bottle of water each .
 
Absolutely not....the day to day politics doesnt affect them! For 16 year olds here ..it absolutely does...so they should get a vote!
For ex-pats to vote in their adopted country... well thats for them to sort out with the local government!
You are ..where you are...simple!
 
Last edited:
AlGard said:
Silent is correct. 15 years is the rule.
So, probably after 12 years here, only 3 more general elections left for me. ;o)

I would have to come back and live in the UK for 18 months if I wanted to start that 15 year process again.

It should be pointed out, that 16 countries in Europe have votes for life for their ex pats.

During a French election, London is the 4th biggest turn out for French voters.
Click to expand...

A couple of years ago I was walking from having parked up north of Wembley Stadium down to a match and there was this queue to a building which must have been at least a half a mile long.

Out of curiosity I asked what everyone was queuing for to be told it was French nationals voting in their election.
 
I haven't voted since leaving because I don't feel it's fair to vote in a country I don't live in and, currently, have no intention of moving back to. When Brexit referendum happened my sister asked me 'why don't you vote to help us *****' (leaving out the brexit or remain here to not cloud the issue!) and I told her the above.

There is the flip side that if I did intend to move back soon then I would want to vote because it would affect me in the near future. There could also be other issues that affect your family and friends - healthcare, EU and immigration status etc that could convince an expat to vote as they will feel it still affects them even if not directly.
 
No representation without taxation.

Obviously different for those non domicile members of the house of lords.

Which constituency does the ex pat vote in?
 
JIMNNINA said:
No representation without taxation
Click to expand...

What a weird world you live in . Maybe only net contributors should be allowed to vote . Or better yet only men that pay taxes .. or how about only men that own land , like the good old days
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

;