Boro - The verdict.

Our problem was we did not get our 2 most creative players Brooks and Danjuma into the game. Brooks had 23 touches of the ball and Danjuma 23. Boro played 352 to our 343. So yet again we are outnumbered in the centre of midfield. Lerma and Gosling has 89 combined touches. Their midfield 3 had 151 combined touches and Boro play direct! If JT wants 3 at the back then we should play 352 with Danjuma alongside a striker and Brooks at the top of a midfield 3 triangle. This would also allow the wingbacks to work the flanks.
 
tedisking said:
Think many on here have to be realistic........if we were to get promoted this season,it would be a far bigger achievement than anything EH did....this is a new era in more ways than one.......finishing mid table in this division would be a good start.
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There's revisionist history and then there's this.

EH getting that squad out of league 2 with the embargo in place was simply remarkable. Don't look at the quality of the squad's subsequent career, he helped make them into who they became. Nobody was queueing up to sign Liam Feeney from Salisbury because there was a Championship player in the making there.

His promotion to the PL was, despite what fans of other teams love to repeat amongst themselves, against the odds with a lower budget than many teams and on the back of selling the striker who had been our best player the previous season.

JT had inherited some problems with morale and tactics but the squad as individuals are exceptional at Championship level and despite what some think it will be added to. His job is to galvanise them and forge a tactical identity that takes advantage of the riches on offer. Not easy but much simpler than driving a bunch of lower league journeymen to the title.
 
So far 'performance' wise we're very very lucky to have four points! If Lewis Cook isn't deemed good enough and he's not willing to play Brooks as part of a three man midfield, we need to get a creative midfielder in asap.
 
kirsikka said:
There's revisionist history and then there's this.

EH getting that squad out of league 2 with the embargo in place was simply remarkable. Don't look at the quality of the squad's subsequent career, he helped make them into who they became. Nobody was queueing up to sign Liam Feeney from Salisbury because there was a Championship player in the making there.

His promotion to the PL was, despite what fans of other teams love to repeat amongst themselves, against the odds with a lower budget than many teams and on the back of selling the striker who had been our best player the previous season.

JT had inherited some problems with morale and tactics but the squad as individuals are exceptional at Championship level and despite what some think it will be added to. His job is to galvanise them and forge a tactical identity that takes advantage of the riches on offer. Not easy but much simpler than driving a bunch of lower league journeymen to the title.
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So what EH did was 'simply remarkable' but JT's task is 'much simpler'? I really disagree. Its going to take a long time to shake off the 'Its Eddies team' if he does well, but as you can tell from the experts on here, only one disappointing result and they're on his back.
 
As another poster has said (perhaps on another thread), the Championship is a very competitive league and is tough to get promoted from.

4 points from two games is a great start and getting a point away V Middlesbrough is no meam feat!

However, square holes in round pegs still seems to be a bit of problem, with one problem being that it seems very difficult to get Stacey, Smith and Rico playing effectively in the same team as JT seems to want.

Some posters want us to play 3 in central midfield and we could do this in a 4-5-1 especially away from home.

However, as JT seems to have settled on 3 at the back playing three in central midfield seems difficult to achieve without leaving out some of our better players.

Would be very intersted to see the suggested team selections from those who want a midfield central three and assuming that we play three at the back!
 
redharry said:
Well I never wanted Tindall in the first place and regardless of our results and performances so far I still would have preferred an outside man to get the job. Having said that I am not really sure I would have expected more so far from a team that has lost the abilities of Rambo, Ake and Wilson. We also lost Fraser, and yes I know he is a little sh-t but another good player gone. Add the loss of the experience and ability of Franno and Surman and you have 6 very good players gone and no replacements at all.
What we are left with is a pretty threadbare squad with a lot of very young players, certainly some very talented ones but with no leaders apparent on or off the pitch. I think many on here need to be realistic, this is a very tough league, 46 games, nothing will come easy, we will lose games where we play well and win some when we play badly. We have to accept the fact that we were not a good team last year so what gives us the right to expect that a team shorn of its best players will get into the top 6.
I think the makings of a good team are there but JT has to make the team his own with a couple of signings and stamp his authority on the side. This is still Eddies side and most of them still think they are playing for him. I think we will end up top half but whether we make the top 6 I don't know. As for JT I think top half keeps him in a job, a slump over the next couple of months and I reckon there will be another internal appointment to take the reins - Graeme Jones.
As for yesterday I am not going to get a bit sniffy at "only" getting a point at Boro.
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I am not against Tindalls appointment.

Great fair and balanced summary.
 
kirsikka said:
There's revisionist history and then there's this.

EH getting that squad out of league 2 with the embargo in place was simply remarkable. Don't look at the quality of the squad's subsequent career, he helped make them into who they became. Nobody was queueing up to sign Liam Feeney from Salisbury because there was a Championship player in the making there.

His promotion to the PL was, despite what fans of other teams love to repeat amongst themselves, against the odds with a lower budget than many teams and on the back of selling the striker who had been our best player the previous season.

JT had inherited some problems with morale and tactics but the squad as individuals are exceptional at Championship level and despite what some think it will be added to. His job is to galvanise them and forge a tactical identity that takes advantage of the riches on offer. Not easy but much simpler than driving a bunch of lower league journeymen to the title.
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JT may have inherited a squad that "as individuals are exceptional at Championship level" but the simple fact is that 6 of the best have since left with no replacements. We are also likely to lose King, so that is 7 gone out of our 25 man squad from last year.
 
RobTrent said:
There's revisionist history and then there's this.

EH getting that squad out of league 2 with the embargo in place was simply remarkable. Don't look at the quality of the squad's subsequent career, he helped make them into who they became. Nobody was queueing up to sign Liam Feeney from Salisbury because there was a Championship player in the making there.

His promotion to the PL was, despite what fans of other teams love to repeat amongst themselves, against the odds with a lower budget than many teams and on the back of selling the striker who had been our best player the previous season.

JT had inherited some problems with morale and tactics but the squad as individuals are exceptional at Championship level and despite what some think it will be added to. His job is to galvanise them and forge a tactical identity that takes advantage of the riches on offer. Not easy but much simpler than driving a bunch of lower league journeymen to the title.
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100%. It’s the ‘our jason’ apologists lining up their excuses early. If Howe has this squad he would walk the league. We just happened to appoint his inferior sidekick without testing the market or interviewing anyone.

Lerma, Brooks, Stanislas, Kelly, Cook x 2, Smith, Stacey, Rico, Danjuma... mid table in this league.... do me a favour! Incredible
 
Neil Dawson said:
100%. It’s the ‘our jason’ apologists lining up their excuses early. If Howe has this squad he would walk the league. We just happened to appoint his inferior sidekick without testing the market or interviewing anyone.

Lerma, Brooks, Stanislas, Kelly, Cook x 2, Smith, Stacey, Rico, Danjuma... mid table in this league.... do me a favour! Incredible
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So you think this side will walk this league ?
 
boscombe botn said:
As another poster has said (perhaps on another thread), the Championship is a very competitive league and is tough to get promoted from.

4 points from two games is a great start and getting a point away V Middlesbrough is no meam feat!

However, square holes in round pegs still seems to be a bit of problem, with one problem being that it seems very difficult to get Stacey, Smith and Rico playing effectively in the same team as JT seems to want.

Some posters want us to play 3 in central midfield and we could do this in a 4-5-1 especially away from home.

However, as JT seems to have settled on 3 at the back playing three in central midfield seems difficult to achieve without leaving out some of our better players.

Would be very intersted to see the suggested team selections from those who want a midfield central three and assuming that we play three at the back!
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Well you wouldn’t play a central three and three at the back. You’d play 4-3-3.
 
RobTrent said:
So what EH did was 'simply remarkable' but JT's task is 'much simpler'? I really disagree. Its going to take a long time to shake off the 'Its Eddies team' if he does well, but as you can tell from the experts on here, only one disappointing result and they're on his back.
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Definition of expert?A condescension of someone that has a different opinion to you.
 
We do still have a whole load of absolute bedwetters on this forum don't we!

Going from....we don't want Tindall....then after Benfica and West Ham: how great it is to see us playing like this! ...to Blackburn....great going forward....to Palace, how great it was to see the young players doing so well! To a dodgy performance away at Boro: we are doomed, Tindall isn't a manager, Begovic is terrible, Solanke is back to being terrible....etc etc....

Oh my days, get a grip will some of you!

JT is still in his VERY early days as a manager, he will be learning with every game, good and bad. He has said he knows he needs a couple of players, so it's not like he isn't aware of this. We have put in bids for two players that we know about. He is asking the team to play in a different way to Eddie, which most of us screamed for across the last couple of seasons. That won't be perfected in two league games. Look at the videos and images of training - you'll see smiles. Didn't always see a lot of that last season. The group seem to be happier right away.

Yes, there are a few things to iron out for sure. But for now, lets stop slagging the same players off the minute they make one error. Lets stop certain posters slagging JT off the moment we play below par. So far, there has been more positives than negatives, so lets all try and be a bit more balanced for the time being at least.
 
Neil Dawson said:
100%. It’s the ‘our jason’ apologists lining up their excuses early. If Howe has this squad he would walk the league. We just happened to appoint his inferior sidekick without testing the market or interviewing anyone.

Lerma, Brooks, Stanislas, Kelly, Cook x 2, Smith, Stacey, Rico, Danjuma... mid table in this league.... do me a favour! Incredible
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A team is about the team not the individuals.

Struggling to fit those 10 players into a 4-3-3?
 
davygravy said:
Lets stop certain posters slagging JT off the moment we play below par.
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Where are we? North Korea?

The Our Jason brigade said choosing him was the only decision because he understood the squad intimately and could hit the ground running the only option apparently in the short covid summer. Couldn’t have an experienced manager because it would take time and time we did not have!!

Now it’s ‘he was always going to need more time’ ‘new to the job’ etc etc.

Hilarious! Some of you need to make your minds up. Anyway... the penny will drop soon.
 
I was expecting us to beat Boro to be honest. They have been in shocking form tail end of the season, and haven't added. 'tough place to go' bit of a cliche, doubt there will have ever been a better time to play them! for watever reason, we just didnt perform as expected, whether thats down to them or us, I honestly can't say.
 
Neil Dawson said:
Where are we? North Korea?

The Our Jason brigade said choosing him was the only decision because he understood the squad intimately and could hit the ground running the only option apparently in the short covid summer. Couldn’t have an experienced manager because it would take time and time we did not have!!

Now it’s ‘he was always going to need more time’ ‘new to the job’ etc etc.

Hilarious! Some of you need to make your minds up. Anyway... the penny will drop soon.
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It was always he'll need more time. Not only that but you said on here you'd give him more time. You're the one coming across as changing your mind.
 
I think the issue for some of us if that if we don;t get promoted this year, is we envisage it will be much tougher next year for various reasons.

The first team is easily good enough for a top 6 challenge... should we have the right man at the helm

You only have to see how Groves conspired to a dreadful start in league 1 despite having a budget 90% plus of the teams could only have dreamed of. Just outside relegation with the money we were spending on wages/transfers... abysmal.

I hope Jason is the man, but although we're unbeaten the performances haven't been overly convincing so far....

Hopefully he;s a quick learner in terms of tactical nous and how to motivate the 'bigger' players we still have on our books. Yesterdays display makes me wonder, but still early days.
 
RobTrent said:
It was always he'll need more time. Not only that but you said on here you'd give him more time. You're the one coming across as changing your mind.
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I’ve never changed my mind from day one. Once he has the job though you can’t state definitively whether he is good or bad until he has had a fair amount of time. That doesn’t change my opinion of how I think it will go
 
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