Eddie is hurt

johnbob said:
Are main problem is we give teams 1 or 2 easy chances a game with silly or bad choices
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Hard to say this while still stinging from Saturday but we had the same issues for the first season in the Championship. Eddie's philosophy has been to take risks and try to coach out the errors.

That approach won the Championship with League One players and kept us in the Premier League for a couple of years with no major changes.
 
Judging by this tweet from Perrett...

"Asked (not by me) whether the possibility of finishing above #saintsfc would represent a successful season for #afcb, Eddie Howe said: “I am not going to start talking about finishing above any team at the moment."

... Eddie's still hurting too...
 
wingsnwheels said:
Nathan Ake has a good footballing brain, I'd certainly like to see him in an attacking midfield role, getting forwards in support of the strikers. Something to work on for next season?
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On the matter of Ake, and Garbo's earlier post, the other Toronto Cherry that I have met was saying something similar on Saturday. Does a midfield of L. Cook, Ake and Joe Allen become a dream scenario? Or are there similarities that undermine the idea? Would this then feed into the 4-3-3 or 4-5-1?
 
paul49 said:
Don't forget that with our main game plan of just playing on the deck most teams have sussed out how to play us. It was all to see against West Brom in the first game of the season. Stop the full backs or wing backs going down the wings and our smaller forwards just don't get the ball or receive the ball with their backs to goal. I said then Defoe was a luxury who we couldn't really fit into our style of play.
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People have said our style has been sussed out across all three PL seasons! They haven't as such....its just that, like all teams, we have some good games and some poor ones!
 
Toronto John said:
On the matter of Ake, and Garbo's earlier post, the other Toronto Cherry that I have met was saying something similar on Saturday. Does a midfield of L. Cook, Ake and Joe Allen become a dream scenario? Or are there similarities that undermine the idea? Would this then feed into the 4-3-3 or 4-5-1?
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Ake's best position is centre back, he's said so himself. And to be honest, with our record of conceding goals, the last thing we want to do is relocate our best defender!
 
klaus_afcb said:
Ake's best position is centre back, he's said so himself. And to be honest, with our record of conceding goals, the last thing we want to do is relocate our best defender!
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Possibly so. If you expect that only S. Cook is a starter next year at the back, we would need one of Simpson or Mings to be ready, and then we need to go out and get two others. Or A. Smith at the back. It just feels that the current four up front could do the job in the right formation, and then you have Fraser, Stanislaus, A. Smith (one place or the other) and Ibe to choose from for pace off the wings. Francis, Surman, Daniels and possibly Gosling to provide bench strength and (if only...) Harry.
 
Toronto John said:
Possibly so. If you expect that only S. Cook is a starter next year at the back, we would need one of Simpson or Mings to be ready, and then we need to go out and get two others.
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With Mings back, our defensive depth suddenly looks alot better and I've still got hopes for Simpson too. However if we need to go out and recruit I'd rather try and find a genuine CM than move Ake into his non-favoured position and have to then recuit to replace him at the back. We know how hard it is to find good quality CBs from past.

I also don't think we should be thinking of A. Smith as as winger. Sure he can do a job there, but for me he's always been most effective and comfortable starting from a deeper position. Plus, if we were to adopt a 4-3-3 with one deep lying midfielder that is providing cover, fullbacks who who can get forward as A.Smith does become all the more important.
 
klaus_afcb said:
Ake's best position is centre back, he's said so himself. And to be honest, with our record of conceding goals, the last thing we want to do is relocate our best defender!
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When did he say that? For his first year at the club he always said his favourite position was defensive midfielder.
 
Just saying ... again and again and again ...

... ball-grabbing midfielder is Top Priority. We WILL struggle next season unless Eddie brings in at least one oven-ready midfield battler. Arter to go, Surman fading, Gosling stumbling ... only L Cook to do the job.

Key issue this season - we lose the ball in midfield and the defence is immediately under pressure. Need players who can win and hold the ball for those crucial seconds. Early signings please.
 
Been mentioned before but a lot of people underestimate the differences between playing as a CB and a defensive midfielder. Even for those CB's who are comfortable on the ball, its a completely different game.

When you play at CB, you have all the pitch infront of you and therefore more time on the ball. As suggested above, we need someone to hold onto the ball in midfield when we are under pressure. This means receiving on the half-turn in tight spaces and being a lot more precise with your distribution.

Surman is excellent at receiving like this, but doesn't have the defensive skills to really be effective. Ake probably could play this role, but since all his success has become as a CB, we'd be far better off recruiting a specialist this summer.
 
...okay obviously if Ake considers himself a centre back then that is fine.

We most definitely need a confident, proven holding defensive central midfielder in the mould of a Kante, Dembele or Matic?

It will be difficult to find one who may want to move to us or that we can afford, but this has to be a priority IMO...Surman, Gosling are not the answer....a fully fit and committed Arter was closer but alas his light has faded...

...Maybe we could get our scouting network to unearth a gem from abroad?

...a sort of PL Marvin Bartley :)
 
So often our problems in defense come on the break with no one in midfield tracking back or putting in a tackle. It’s much harder to defend as the last man chasing back than in the middle of the park knowing that you have cover. For me Ake would be a great solution, at the very least as a short term option until we get someone better suited. When under the cosh he would be trusted as a 5th defender and we know that he can cover ground and get involved in both build up and attacking play. Because of this he adds an element of unpredictability, certain teams won’t know how to mark him- this inherently creates chaos and generates space for other players around him to use (the Fellaini effect?).

Alongside Lewis Cook I think they could form a formidable CM pairing which could strengthen us both from an attacking and defensive standpoint. We potentially lose some bite from the last line of defense but at our current rate of conceding I’d rather be working on winning the ball further up the pitch and taking some pressure off our back 4.
 
langham said:
Just saying ... again and again and again ...

... ball-grabbing midfielder is Top Priority. We WILL struggle next season unless Eddie brings in at least one oven-ready midfield battler. Arter to go, Surman fading, Gosling stumbling ... only L Cook to do the job.

Key issue this season - we lose the ball in midfield and the defence is immediately under pressure. Need players who can win and hold the ball for those crucial seconds. Early signings please.
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Totally agree with Langham. Midfield has been our Achilles heel since we’ve been in the prem. Lewis is a fantastic young talent but he can’t manage midfield on his own. Eddie needs to recruit quality additions if we are to make any progress.
 
DodgerCherry said:
Totally agree with Langham. Midfield has been our Achilles heel since we’ve been in the prem. Lewis is a fantastic young talent but he can’t manage midfield on his own. Eddie needs to recruit quality additions if we are to make any progress.
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Agreed but the problem is usually caused either side of the pitch by our fullback playing the ball to the winger who has come inside, the fullback sprinting on down the wing to receive the ball back but the winger is pressed and loses the ball. The full back is way out of position and we are immediately under pressure. I've lost count of how many times that has happened this season.
 
paul49 said:
Agreed but the problem is usually caused either side of the pitch by our fullback playing the ball to the winger who has come inside, the fullback sprinting on down the wing to receive the ball back but the winger is pressed and loses the ball. The full back is way out of position and we are immediately under pressure. I've lost count of how many times that has happened this season.
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Yes I agree with all that but we keep giving the ball away in midfield which puts our back four under pressure from counter attacking.
 
I find myself having lost confidence in the team of late and feel we aren’t firing on all cylinders. Too many players don’t perform as in the past and we don’t have any true leaders on the pitch. Even with the great signings of Ake, Begovic and L Cook, we seem to have not progressed as a team and watching us currently is stressful and laboured. Does anyone have any ideas as to what’s gone wrong ?
 
DodgerCherry said:
I find myself having lost confidence in the team of late and feel we aren’t firing on all cylinders. Too many players don’t perform as in the past and we don’t have any true leaders on the pitch. Even with the great signings of Ake, Begovic and L Cook, we seem to have not progressed as a team and watching us currently is stressful and laboured. Does anyone have any ideas as to what’s gone wrong ?
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I think if any of us genuinely had the answer, we'd be managing the team rather than writing opinions on forums. However, my take is Eddie is stuck between two schools of thought. Do we want to play like Barca, Man City or perhaps more relevantly Swansea of old? Dominating possession and playing from the back. Or do we want to play a more old fashioned English attacking high tempo game with 2 strikers?

This is the challenge he has over the summer with his recruitment and how we set up in games for next season. If we are going to go with the English style 2 strikers, then I believe we need to be more direct with our build up play. If it is to me the possession approach, then a rethink in midfield is required. What I personally don't think works is trying a bit of both approaches and neither particularly successfuly.
 
Ideally you want your leaders to be your best players or at least the most committed in the mould of someone like Gerrard who was a player and fan rolled into one. Three ' leaders' needed, back, middle and front. Logically, L.Cook eventually or Ake if they stay but are they strong enough of vocal enough to lead? When Frannos gone, I'm hoping Nathan will take up the strain aided by Lewis. Up front and dressing room it should have been Defoe- what a disappointment all round!
 
Liking the talk of Joe Allen but...

Joe Allen 5ft 6
Lewis Cook 5 ft 9
Harry Arter 5ft 10
Andrew Surman 5ft 10 (and never looks what the kids these days call "Dench")
Even Ake is only 5ft 11.

Let's look at some "proper" midfielders now:

Yaya Toure 6ft 2 (and made Gosling look like a child trying to get the ball off him in the back garden a couple of seasons ago)
Fellaini 6ft 4/5
Matic 6ft 4
Xabi Alonso 6ft
Pogba 6ft 3
Viera 6ft 4
Wanyama 6ft

I could go on. We don't get even close to competing with these players. Moussa Dembele is another that Harry spoke about himself. 6ft 1 if you're wondering. Held players off and quickly recycled the ball. Harry asked him on the field during a match how the hell he does it.

Are we going the way of the sideways passing midgets? Should we be? A lot of our midfield are pretty weedy by Prem standards and don't necessarily even have the technical aspects to their game to make up for it (with the possible exception of Lewis Cook). Any professional footballer should be able to run about for 90 minutes so that's not an attribute I'm going to consider, although that starts me on another train of thought that makes me think we have to do some much running to make up for our ineptness that we end up tiring more quickly across a sesaon than other teams...

Back on topic, I really would be happy with some big lump or other to put in front of the defence. I don't even care if their passing is as bad as Dan Gosling's. If they can put a tackle in and get back and cover we have plenty of other players who can play out.

Agree with Dodger above that our excellent signings (on paper at least) haven't resulted in an improvement as expected. We do look more crap than good on the whole this season and it's been frustrating to watch.
 
They used to say that Bournemouth could easily be bullied because of the number of shrimps in our squad. That eventually changed - it would be a mistake to sign minimen again.

Can’t believe there aren’t suitable candidates for the midfield terrier role. Key issue: move fast before the targets are scooped by others. We have the money - is the scouting/recruitment team up to the job?
 
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