Non - Afghanistan

billythekid said:
Remember many years ago when Russia were in there and in the end they had to pull out.

Those fighting the Russians then were the Mujahideen well versed on the terrain and carried out a guerrilla war and hid up in the mountains/hills.

Remember seeing reports from their hideouts with TV reporter/s being up in the hills with them filming, it seemed they were the ‘good guys’.

When we went in and after what happened during Russia’s time there didn’t think it would ever end well.
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You can not win a counter insurgency war. The enemy hides within the population, you are fighting an idea rather than an enemy force.

We never went into win a war, though. We went into to stop Afghanistan being used as the bed rock for global terrorism, after that the main effort was to teach the government to fend for itself. We did, we did it well. Its not our fault that the government of that country is completely idiotic and greedy. I have more respect for the taliban then I do them.
 
sam adams said:
Terrible for the folk in that country, especially the females who will now be completely subjugated, a real mess. This interview is worth listening to Colonel Richard Kemp who is a guest of Mark Levin. Stick with the start as a picture of El Trumpo appears but Richard Kemp gives an honest appraisal of the situation.
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Putting aside that this is the usual extreme right-wing opinion piece that the poster is renowned for, why is it that the concern for women's rights is at best disingenuous and, at worst, just plain false.

Anyone remember the misogynistic lies that were posted about Hilary Clinton during the 2016 US presidential election? Not only that the lies were presented as "news" from extremist websites introducing us all to the term "fake news"

But, yes, its terrible. What is that the Mujahideen, which became the Taliban and morphed into Al Qaeda was created by the USA through the CIA. Also, terrible that Biden is having to carry the can for Trump's policy

Especially worry about the females. Think about the 50% of the population still waiting for the Equal Rights Amendment to be passed in the USA (y'know, the land of the free and all that). The result is that women are not equal to men in the eyes of the law in America.

Christian-backed thugs in Southern states can and do rape and sexually assault. Far too many get away with it. Some even get put in high office. Yet a violated woman can be denied denied an abortion if a pregnancy results. She is punished twice because has to carry the child of her rapist to full term.

So, do be concerned about freedoms in Afghanistan, do be bothered about human rights in other countires, do be very worried about women's rights. But also beware those misogynists who ignore what is going on closer to home.
 
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What a waste of lives of UK and USA soldiers and the civilians also killed/hurt. Both Iraq and Afghanistan are places we should have left alone, if a country lives under a tyrant like Iraq or an extreme religious group like the taliban it is not our job to intervene. Having served in the Middle East I can say most of the people were decent and just wanted to get on with their lives but obviously there were those that didn’t want westerners invading and fought against us and there also groups funded by Iran.
Afghanistan will be completely under the taliban before the years out and the only way to stop it is for the good people of Afghan to step up and fight against them. A large problem has always been Iraq/Afghan military being very poor and unable to stand up against ISIS or the Taliban. All around very sad and the people of Afghanistan will be the ones to suffer.
as others have said current and past presidents and prime ministers never really seemed to know what to do. Going in and controlling/securing the country is one thing and comfortably done by coalition forces but after that the ongoing mission seemed all over the place with no objective.
 
ErikthViking said:
Terrible that the Mujahideen, which became the Taliban and morphed into Al Qaeda was created by the USA through the CIA.

Especially worry about the females - still waiting for the Equal Rights Act to be passed in the USA (y'know, the land of the free and all that) - who can be raped by Christian-backed thugs in Southern states yet denied an abortion if a pregnancy results.[/QUOTE

Did your wife run off with an American? And you’re job get sourced to the USA leaving you unemployed and your Ford car break down ( not a surprise with a Ford )
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Sky

Resistance fighters prepare for battle as clashes with Taliban loom

While the Taliban's rapid capture of power in Afghanistan means its imminent control of the entire country is seen by many as inevitable, there remain pockets of resistance if must contend with first.

Among those determined to prevent the group seizing their region are these men in Panjshir.

The latest reports indicate Taliban fighters are near the province, a mountainous area northwest of Kabul which resisted the Taliban before 2001

There, forces loyal to Ahmad Massoud, son of the anti-Soviet mujahideen commander Ahmad Shah Massoud, have established themselves.

Late on Sunday, the Taliban's Alemarah information service said hundreds of fighters were heading towards Panjshir but that there had been no immediate confirmation of any fighting.

Zabihullah Mujahid said the Salang Pass, on the main highway running from southern Afghanistan to the north, was open and enemy forces were blockaded in the Panjshir valley. However, his statement suggested there was no fighting for the moment.
 
ErikthViking said:
Terrible that the Mujahideen, which became the Taliban and morphed into Al Qaeda was created by the USA through the CIA.

Especially worry about the females - still waiting for the Equal Rights Act to be passed in the USA (y'know, the land of the free and all that) - who can be raped by Christian-backed thugs in Southern states yet denied an abortion if a pregnancy results.
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Are you off your medication again Erik ?
 
I've just started to re-read "Flashman" which describes the catastrophic retreat from Kabul in 1842.

Wildly politically incorrect, but it's a really well-written adventure and provides a vivid account of that particular military disaster.

In some respects, not a lot has changed over the past 180 years...
 
davidwhitehead said:
I've just started to re-read "Flashman" which describes the catastrophic retreat from Kabul in 1842.

Wildly politically incorrect, but it's a really well-written adventure and provides a vivid account of that particular military disaster.

In some respects, not a lot has changed over the past 180 years...
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I remember reading them years ago very funny series. As you said nothing much changed over there and mostly likely never will
 
davidwhitehead said:
I've just started to re-read "Flashman" which describes the catastrophic retreat from Kabul in 1842.

Wildly politically incorrect, but it's a really well-written adventure and provides a vivid account of that particular military disaster.

In some respects, not a lot has changed over the past 180 years...
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A very interesting read is . "The Great Game" The Struggle For Empire in Central Asia, by Peter Hopkirk.
 
One scenario is that we ..and USA... stay out of the Area. for a considerable time..

..and if in the long term Russia or China have strengthened positions there as a result..and wanna 'av a go ' ...OK we join up with USA and give ' em some...thats the drill Kimo Sabe !
Forget that for a minute.
I'm not sure where I am on this now...tied between an ex- serviceman's traditional stance .. I.e. actively on the front foot ready for action to suppress the bad b@srards..or constructively/ sensibly passive, hoping it all subsides...veering toward the latter I'm thinking.

You want to choke these aggressive regimes.. but then you have to see the costs...further human costs.. and as we know the Americans can get bomb happy and mistake prone...putting their own troops..AND Civilians/kids in danger.. own goals etc.
No winners in these confrontions..in fact odds are heavily stacked another way!
..
 
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It has been nearly twenty years since I watched with sadness as the beautiful towers came down. As I watched with horror the Falling Man, having subsequent nightmares of falling 1000 feet at the speed of gravity. As I watched in disbelief the 2002 film by the Naudet brothers that captured the events in chilling fashion, especially the faces of the firefighters in the lobby of the buildings as they were ordered to head up the stairs.

At the time, I wanted retribution of the highest order. Nuke the damn region, and dispose of any that would bring such crimes to our door.

The Americans and the subsequent coalition took on the fight. One big strategic error took place. They eliminated despotic sociopaths, only to allow other despotic sociopaths to fill the void. However, they put in quite a shift .... 20 years trying to clean out the cesspool and develop a government and fighting force that could maintain order in a lawless land. Can you stay there forever? I would think not, although the plans to vacate the area seem to have been poorly constructed.

However, ask yourselves this .......... do you feel safer today taking the tube than you did in July 2005? The incidence of coordinated terrorist attacks has been kept in check by the efforts of the men and women who served the Coalition. So if your answer is "yes", go find one of them and thank them for their service. And hope like mad that the situation in Afghanistan doesn't bring us back to those horrible times.

To those on here who served over there ............. :tophat:
 
Toronto John said:
It has been nearly twenty years since I watched with sadness as the beautiful towers came down. As I watched with horror the Falling Man, having subsequent nightmares of falling 1000 feet at the speed of gravity. As I watched in disbelief the 2002 film by the Naudet brothers that captured the events in chilling fashion, especially the faces of the firefighters in the lobby of the buildings as they were ordered to head up the stairs.

At the time, I wanted retribution of the highest order. Nuke the damn region, and dispose of any that would bring such crimes to our door.

The Americans and the subsequent coalition took on the fight. One big strategic error took place. They eliminated despotic sociopaths, only to allow other despotic sociopaths to fill the void. However, they put in quite a shift .... 20 years trying to clean out the cesspool and develop a government and fighting force that could maintain order in a lawless land. Can you stay there forever? I would think not, although the plans to vacate the area seem to have been poorly constructed.

However, ask yourselves this .......... do you feel safer today taking the tube than you did in July 2005? The incidence of coordinated terrorist attacks has been kept in check by the efforts of the men and women who served the Coalition. So if your answer is "yes", go find one of them and thank them for their service. And hope like mad that the situation in Afghanistan doesn't bring us back to those horrible times.

To those on here who served over there ............. :tophat:
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We've got some thoughtful insight from people who have actually served over there and then we have this.

The answer to your question is no.
 
Toronto John said:
Really? Why not? I went to NYC many times after 9/11 and never feared a coordinated attack.
edit .... and was in London in 2012 and 2014. Same lack of trepidation.
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Unfortunately we've had plenty of terrorist attacks in London since. Our intelligence services have managed to stop more or worse thankfully but that's not because we invaded a 'cesspool'.
 
SlowDownDerek said:
Unfortunately we've had plenty of terrorist attacks in London since. Our intelligence services have managed to stop more or worse thankfully but that's not because we invaded a 'cesspool'.
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Unless I've got it wrong, those were mostly brought on by home grown radicalized individuals, though weren't they? That's not in the same league as 4, or 10, or 19 terrorists working together as directed from a terrorist regime, such regimes having been largely disrupted in the past 10-15 years.

You are absolutely right though that intelligence services locally are vigilant, and have to be so.
 
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