Non - FUND THE NHS!!

Druss_the_Legend

Druss_the_Legend

UTC Legend
Sorry, if you dont want to read a long emotional rant then please at least watch this video of Jeff Stelling before clicking away...


I am so tired and fed up of fighting to get help for different members of my family with various health issues only to constantly meet the brick wall of lack of resources. How have we fallen so far? The US has a system that is completely fecked but if you have insurance you at least get treated. I pay £6 for my cats insurance. One of them had an op to remove a tumour and the other developed a bad cough, was seen the same day, had a suite of tests under general anaesthetic 48 hours later and had the results 4 days later.

How are we, as a country, failing our NHS so badly? How can pets get access to high quality rapid medical help for the cost of £6 a month while humans face long delays or absolutely no help or support. Ive been told by health professionals (GPs) to take family members to A&E to force the NHS to help. Thats not what its there for surely?!?!

So you then have try to help your family best you can by paying for private services, private counselling, private medical support to cover the hole there is in our own system. You spend your savings, you take out debt, you continue to fight for them daily and all you get from the NHS is silence and brick walls. There is nothing worse than trying to help loved ones and being helpless to do so.

Its absolutely disgusting. I have no idea who the next government will be or what they plan to do with the NHS but these current mother feckers have run it in to the ground for the last 13 years and the sooner they are gone the better.
 
SlowDownDerek said:
Because they all have age profiles like this and never planned properly for what to do when the massive baby boom block reached retirement age.

We can't afford to pay their pensions and treat their illnesses and we've known this was coming for 70 years.

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As much as I hate the corporate type cliche, far too often government policies/decisions are reactive rather than pro-active.

'Cats out the bag' and damage already being done in many scenarios by the time many issues are addressed (or started to be...) or taken seriously it seems.
 
All parties too afraid to make those difficult decisions on future funding, as they need the votes now. Unfortunately, if any one of them did ever suggest they were going to take more tax or whatever, the opposition would undoubtedly pounce on them to score points, whilst secretly wiping their brow that it wasnt them.
 
Kenya Cherrie said:
Its the same problem in most European countries,
Not enough staff and too many old people are blocking the system.
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Yes, but speaking to friends in France and Germany, the concept of "waiting lists" is unknown.

You can get to see a specialist very quickly indeed, you don't need a GP referral. If you look at comparative outcomes for, say, cancer, our results are poor.

I certainly don't know what the answer is - I have no idea if it's actually true that the NHS is an administrative nightmare that we spend too much on "managers".

But I think we need to have a rethink as to how the NHS is financed and organised. Of course, we absolutely need to keep the "free at the point of use" principle, but that is pretty standard across Western Europe.
 
The same old. It needs reform but is in a constant state of reform. Each round of reform from each new PM or Health Sec takes 2-3 years to filter down. God knows how many reboots various Health Secs have attempted over the various Tory PMships. Then Labour will start their own reforms, before the last set of reforms have even finished. And round and round it goes.

NHS management constantly running around trying to restructure, nobody ever knowing if the last reform was any better or worse, and nobody actually looking at patients and clinical issues.

I know from my own time there that the constant restructuring causes massive amounts of time and resource being distracted away from patients and clinical issues.

In some ways just leaving it alone for a while might be helpful, but then if politicians aren't seen to be "doing something about the NHS" it looks bad.

General tax is the highest it's ever been, NHS funding is the highest it's ever been (excluding Covid years), and I'm sure it will increase further in future. But it still can't keep up with demand outstripping capacity. We still can't fill vacancies and shouldn't keep robbing poorer countries of staff forever but also our national demography does us no favours as SDD points out.

The model is broken and all anyone ever says is 'but but but America'. Well fine, let's rule out the US system straight off the bat. Then what?
 
davidwhitehead said:
Yes, but speaking to friends in France and Germany, the concept of "waiting lists" is unknown.

You can get to see a specialist very quickly indeed, you don't need a GP referral. If you look at comparative outcomes for, say, cancer, our results are poor.

I certainly don't know what the answer is - I have no idea if it's actually true that the NHS is an administrative nightmare that we spend too much on "managers".

But I think we need to have a rethink as to how the NHS is financed and organised. Of course, we absolutely need to keep the "free at the point of use" principle, but that is pretty standard across Western Europe.
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Or you can get GP referrals and then nothing... so the GP has to raise complaints themselves to the NHS because their referrals are thrown back. The whole state of our NHS at the moment is a embarrassment to this country.
 
northstandmark said:
The same old. It needs reform but is in a constant state of reform. Each round of reform from each new PM or Health Sec takes 2-3 years to filter down. God knows how many reboots various Health Secs have attempted over the various Tory PMships. Then Labour will start their own reforms, before the last set of reforms have even finished. And round and round it goes.

NHS management constantly running around trying to restructure, nobody ever knowing if the last reform was any better or worse, and nobody actually looking at patients and clinical issues.

I know from my own time there that the constant restructuring causes massive amounts of time and resource being distracted away from patients and clinical issues.

In some ways just leaving it alone for a while might be helpful, but then if politicians aren't seen to be "doing something about the NHS" it looks bad.

General tax is the highest it's ever been, NHS funding is the highest it's ever been (excluding Covid years), and I'm sure it will increase further in future. But it still can't keep up with demand outstripping capacity. We still can't fill vacancies and shouldn't keep robbing poorer countries of staff forever.

The model is broken and all anyone ever says is 'but but but America'. Well fine, let's rule out the US system straight off the bat. Then what?
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The US spends more on healthcare per head than than the UK and they still dont cover everyone. Our system should work...but it needs proper funding. Its simply being left to die.
 

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I heard on the radio this morning of someone who has £175 million.

My personal view is that is unnecessarily obscene.
 
GaryRB said:
All parties too afraid to make those difficult decisions on future funding, as they need the votes now. Unfortunately, if any one of them did ever suggest they were going to take more tax or whatever, the opposition would undoubtedly pounce on them to score points, whilst secretly wiping their brow that it wasnt them.
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Thats what I like about the Danish governments multi-party system, 17 at the moment.
these decisions are voted by all parties.
 
I know absolutely nothing about Amanda Pritchard, but what I do know is for the 5th biggest employer in the world, £260k a year is simply not going to get you the best person for the job. It's about two zeros shy of being what it would be as a private organisation.

The public would go mad when the press got wind of it, but if you want serious change, that's where I'd start.
 
GaryRB said:
All parties too afraid to make those difficult decisions on future funding, as they need the votes now. Unfortunately, if any one of them did ever suggest they were going to take more tax or whatever, the opposition would undoubtedly pounce on them to score points, whilst secretly wiping their brow that it wasnt them.
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Problem is the whole system and trust in it and government is broken.

People wouldn't have problem with more tax imo, if you had the upmost/unwavering confidence as to where it was being used, and everyone was paying their proper 'bit', rather than mega corps or extremely rich wriggling out of it.

When you hear about politicians and decisions around stuff government spend funds on in media every few months, and particularly some of what happened during covid,people would be up in arms if tax was hiked. As no doubt soon after we'd hear about how Johnson or whoever had used funds for his own benefit/lifetstyle, or some dodgy deal with mates (PPE...).
 
Druss_the_Legend said:
The US spends more on healthcare per head than than the UK and they still dont cover everyone. Our system should work...but it needs proper funding. Its simply being left to die.
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Should it work? It obviously worked when the demographic balance of taxpayers to older people was better balanced but who's to say that it is affordable with the current and future demographic balance? We have the highest tax burden since the war and we still can't seem to fund it properly.
 
I have been saying for years now .....why dont we pay extra for the NHS....if you are lucky to have an NHS dentist you still pay a certain amount ,something like £23 for a check up.......when you are in hospital you get fed (nothing special I grant you ) so why not pay a small amount....you would be eating at home if not hospitalised.....£10 a week ?.....£5 for any appointments or day surgery ?think most right minded people would go along with this ?
 
SlowDownDerek said:
Should it work? It obviously worked when the demographic balance of taxpayers to older people was better balanced but who's to say that it is affordable with the current and future demographic balance? We have the highest tax burden since the war and we still can't seem to fund it properly.
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Tax more then! Tax the super rich. Tax the record profits of large corporations.

If you want a crazy idea... just as pensions have become legally mandated on companies, what about health insurance? I havent thought too much into the impact of it but surely something to look at.

I really dont know the answer but people are dying daily because some parts of the NHS are a shambles and it has to be fixed.
 
Where are the resources coming from for private medical treatment ?

Running essential services as profit making doesnt work for those who cant pay the asking price
Too many lucrative contracts for preferred suppliers who fail too deliver better for less cost

What are the Trusts doing for staff and patients ?

Lions lead by donkeys

www.bbc.co.uk

Simon Case: Top official thought Johnson couldn't lead on Covid

Simon Case said the former PM changed direction "every day", in evidence heard by the Covid inquiry.
www.bbc.co.uk
 
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