Hamed Traore

Neil Dawson said:
I don’t have to mentally prepare myself. If we can dodge the bullet by getting him sold to them I’d be over the moon. Clearly he is suited to Italian football from the reviews he had before we signed him. Doesn’t mean he was going to be suited to us\Englsnd which a good recruitment team work out.
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he was suited to a different style to what we have now, if we didn't get AI then perhaps he would of played a more important role for us
 
Not defending or moaning at anyone, but you'd need the patience of a saint if you were in the camp of still giving Traore time here... I know he had his injuries and illnesses etc. but he just never seemed to settle in games where he was given the chance and looked totally lost out there... It's 100% not his fault but he did carry a large fee on his head and unfortunately, with that comes expectations... Expectations that he looked a million miles away from, here.

No one was is saying he is sh*t, just that he wasn't suited here and for me, the move away and hopefully permanent, is probably the best for all parties...
 
SteveJonesLegend said:
Not defending or moaning at anyone, but you'd need the patience of a saint if you were in the camp of still giving Traore time here... I know he had his injuries and illnesses etc. but he just never seemed to settle in games where he was given the chance and looked totally lost out there... It's 100% not his fault but he did carry a large fee on his head and unfortunately, with that comes expectations... Expectations that he looked a million miles away from, here.

No one was is saying he is sh*t, just that he wasn't suited here and for me, the move away and hopefully permanent, is probably the best for all parties...
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Yep.
 
SteveJonesLegend said:
Not defending or moaning at anyone, but you'd need the patience of a saint if you were in the camp of still giving Traore time here... I know he had his injuries and illnesses etc. but he just never seemed to settle in games where he was given the chance and looked totally lost out there... It's 100% not his fault but he did carry a large fee on his head and unfortunately, with that comes expectations... Expectations that he looked a million miles away from, here.

No one was is saying he is sh*t, just that he wasn't suited here and for me, the move away and hopefully permanent, is probably the best for all parties...
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Similarly, I'm not having a pop at anyone, but I think he's only made 10 appearances hasn't he? Not sure if that is the patience of a saint these days, but I'm still sitting on the fence.

I'm not disputing that he has underwhelmed so far, but I think there is a player in there. Under Andoni, I would like to have seen a fully fit Traore have a go at the 10 role, where Kluivert is probably our best option at the moment.

Whether he could operate the press as well I don't know, but there is a creative player in there, who can pick a pass, and might just flourish with more freedom to roam between the lines of the opposition defence and midfield. All just opinions though.
 
SteveJonesLegend said:
I know he had his injuries and illnesses etc. but he just never seemed to settle in games where he was given the chance and looked totally lost out there...
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I actually thought he looked alright as did others I go with, certainly not in the camp of 'lets get rid'. I felt he needed a decent run in the team, we've all seen what confidence can do to a player as well. He proved last night he can be very comfortable at the highest level and was well regarded in Serie A before he came.

Hindsight is great isn't (I'm not having a dig at you). He clearly didn't settle and there was the talk of personal issues as well (homesick ?) plus he got seriously ill. I'm not sure how you can forecast things like this and then use it as a stick to beat the club with but hey ho.
 
Neil Dawson said:
Like he did under Gon?

A professional Director of football would have a philosophy and a style of play that you build a club around. You can then recruit managers and players to fit that mould.

It’s not about changing manager and style every year and having to overload transfer windows with players that turn out to be unsuitable for the next manager in.
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pretty sure this has been gone over before but didn't he play in every match he was fit for GON?
 
Anyway, Hamed Traore is a decent player, well suited to Italy and possibly might even make it in the PL with us or another club. Either way if the club do manage to offload him for the money mentioned it will have been a decent outcome. Not all signings work but if you can minimise the damage of those that don't you've done well.
 
I think it is very easy to look at things black and white only. A signing can be a good signing even if it doesn't work out, sometimes the only way to tell if they will work out, especially with different countries is by taking a chance. There is clearly a player in Traore and the people behind identifying him and getting it over the line should be applauded, not criticized in my opinion.

I'll be the first to admit it hasn't worked out here yet but I wouldn't be against him coming back. He only played 10 games for us and had to contend with injury, Ramadan and new surroundings and language barriers - no wonder he hasn't hit the ground running.

We see it time and time again where foreign players come alive in their second season once they have settled and adapted - it could happen here.

Either way, no club is going to get transfers 100% right, but I think there has been very few we have got wrong when everything is taken into account. I'll even include Fredericks and Brad Smith in that if anyone would like an adult debate about that :)
 
Neil Dawson said:
Iturbe played in the champions league for Roma. Another cracking Hughes signing presumably using your odd logic…
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Strong rumours at the time was that the new American investors wanted him as 'marquee' kind of signing.

Anyway, I thought Howe responsible fir all of signings back then, according to you?
 
SteveJonesLegend said:
Not defending or moaning at anyone, but you'd need the patience of a saint if you were in the camp of still giving Traore time here... I know he had his injuries and illnesses etc. but he just never seemed to settle in games where he was given the chance and looked totally lost out there... It's 100% not his fault but he did carry a large fee on his head and unfortunately, with that comes expectations... Expectations that he looked a million miles away from, here.

No one was is saying he is sh*t, just that he wasn't suited here and for me, the move away and hopefully permanent, is probably the best for all parties...
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Some posters are saying that he is sh*t, that’s why people are resonding

Your summary is right though.

Think GON would have played him more. This is why I am worried if AI only has 1 more season but changing the squad to suit him.

I liked traore and still think he had a decent playing future ahead of him. However, we don’t have the ffp headroom to leave a €30m player in the reserves so best to sell.
 
AFCBade said:
Some posters are saying that he is sh*t, that’s why people are resonding
Your summary is right though.
Think GON would have played him more. This is why I am worried if AI only has 1 more season but changing the squad to suit him.
I liked traore and still think he had a decent playing future ahead of him. However, we don’t have the ffp headroom to leave a €30m player in the reserves so best to sell.
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We shouldn’t be changing the system for Al. We should be dictating the system and style we want to play and signing players for that system and style. That therefore dictates having a number of managers on a shortlist that fit that style when Andoni moves on. Like Potter to De Zerbi…
 
Neil Dawson said:
We shouldn’t be changing the system for Al. We should be dictating the system and style we want to play and signing players for that system and style. That therefore dictates having a number of managers on a shortlist that fit that style when Andoni moves on. Like Potter to De Zerbi…
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they picked 2 managers/head coach that were similar (Potter takes longer for his style to shine through though), I think Potter prefers a slower build up where as de zerbi is a quicker game, but the board done well while even know the team tactics were different the players they had adapted well to the shift in game plan.
I wonder if there were any players who were there but didn't feature under Potter much but were better under de zerbi and same other way round?
 
Neil Dawson said:
We shouldn’t be changing the system for Al. We should be dictating the system and style we want to play and signing players for that system and style. That therefore dictates having a number of managers on a shortlist that fit that style when Andoni moves on. Like Potter to De Zerbi…
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But we have changed our system, via Iraola...??? I agree that we hopefully have several names on a piece of paper that can carry on from Iraola, should he leave after 2 years (Which I seriously hope he doesn't)... However, we have a manager that has dictated our style of play... I very much doubt Foley laid out the detail of what he wanted, he just knew he wanted a more attacking style of play... Iraola has brought that and is 100% shaping the team in his philosophy and play...

His style will be difficult to replicate for a new manager, and I do worry about him just getting the team to click next year and he buggers off...
 
SteveJonesLegend said:
His style will be difficult to replicate for a new manager, and I do worry about him just getting the team to click next year and he buggers off...
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Totally agree. If we are going to continue to back him and shape the squad to suit his needs, I'd really like to hear that he has signed an extension in the summer.

Hopefully he sees, as we do, that his system is starting to take effect and he'll be as interested as we are to see how far that can take us.

I think this is a great job for him at the moment. As long as his family is settled here, I'd like to think that he'd be prepared to commit to two more seasons at least in the summer.
 
The idea that there is a bunch of off-the-shelf managers with the same style of football readily available whenever you need one is pure cloud cuckooland nonsense.

De Zerbi wasn't part of some long-term plan for Brighton he was just available when they needed a manager. He was on the radar of all clubs including ours and Brighton were best placed to get him given how they'd not been relegated and suffered a huge budget shock.
 
SlowDownDerek said:
The idea that there is a bunch of off-the-shelf managers with the same style of football readily available whenever you need one is pure cloud cuckooland nonsense.

De Zerbi wasn't part of some long-term plan for Brighton he was just available when they needed a manager. He was on the radar of all clubs including ours and Brighton were best placed to get him given how they'd not been relegated and suffered a huge budget shock.
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I'd hope that we've got an eye on managers that have a similar style of play if this is what Bill wants to see on the pitch long term. Particularly if we know there's a chance that Iraola won't sign a new contract. Absolutely no idea if there is, and if there is if they'd be interested in us.
 
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