Home matches / points
- Thread starter kirsikka
- Start date
DJ
Moderator
The more I think about it the more disappointed I am.
They're clearly openly using this as some form of exercise to determine demand for a new stadium, but that only works if the historical data is accurate and we know that's unlikely.
northstandmark
UTC Legend
I think I can see what the club are going for and it's not a terrible idea to give newbies more of a chance with some small specific allocation. They just need to be careful about the execution of the idea. Tweak the weightings for future games and it might work better. I don't think this first attempt was great, just going off what I hear from friends who don't have STs. It does risk disgruntlement.
Also wouldn't be overly confident in creating a 10am scramble situation for thousands of people if I was the sysadmin looking after the ticketing system. We all know how unstable that can be. All it'll take is one incident where it falls over and everyone will lose faith in 'the strategy'.
Also wouldn't be overly confident in creating a 10am scramble situation for thousands of people if I was the sysadmin looking after the ticketing system. We all know how unstable that can be. All it'll take is one incident where it falls over and everyone will lose faith in 'the strategy'.
wellsworld
Star Player
my take, as a ST holder who fortunately isn't involved in the scramble, is that they are making an already complicated system even more complicated to the average punter who is not really interested in learning all about ticket points, new schemes etc.
if someone asked me how they go about getting a ticket for an afcb game, I'd say "dont bother", I wouldnt attempt to explain "ticket tuesday" or watever its called, lifes too short!
if someone asked me how they go about getting a ticket for an afcb game, I'd say "dont bother", I wouldnt attempt to explain "ticket tuesday" or watever its called, lifes too short!
RobTrent
UTC Legend
It could be argued that if the club are splitting the season into categories, then maybe they should weight the points. Attending Cat C matches would be better than A.
Overly complicated I know…
wellsworld
Star Player
no, more complication is good. lets go the whole hog! one advantage is that it keeps a whole subsection of society away from footy, theres no way old-timers like new_old_cherry are going to wade thru these rules. footy should only be for forum-loving, rules-based, var fanboy, IT nerds.
Last edited:
DJ
Moderator
I gave it a go the other day on the school pick-up, the exact target audience that the new regime is targeting, young families. That principle of course is spot on, but the execution just like a lot of the communication this summer is muddled.
You need an email address for each person, to then register for an account for each person, if you're lucky the system will enable you to link all the accounts together on their friends and family list (this sometimes doesn't work, it doesn't on my account for example!) .
Then on a Tuesday when the initial allocation is sold-out, then anyone with a point can join the lottery, of getting through to order tickets.
So tickets go on sale every Tuesday? No, only the Tuesdays that follow when tickets have sold out on the points system... so when is that roughly on a regular basis? I don't know.
Will we be able to choose where we sit? No, don't think so, tickets are extremely limited.
But we will be able to sit together as a family of 4? Well, I think so, but usually, it's just single seats dotted about.
Can we get in the family stand? No idea to be honest.
Yep sounds easy, think we'll decide closer to the time. Oh no, it'll be done this Tuesday with the game about 4 weeks later...
wellsworld
Star Player
DJ
Moderator
I would imagine if you've got 15 out of 19 home points from last season, you're not going on your own. But this system feels like its just looking at "Customer account holders" rather than the bigger picture.
It's unlikely that account holder goes on their own and sits randomly in different areas of the ground every week. They're going to have a partner, a friend, a family member, or maybe a group of all of the above in the same round-about points bracket, they're going to try and sit in the same seat or as close to it as possible.
All of that has gone for them.
Areas of the ground no longer available to select, will they all be able to get seats together in the lottery of 1+ points? Will they even be able to get online when the system goes live to get tickets to go at all?
So we lose a potential group of supporters who go on a very regular basis, all in the hunt of new supporters, who may or may not want to attend as regularly.
Some supporters will only want to attend a few times a season. I just don't see how the "data" is going to show this to new regime.
Cherry_Bozzo
Fans' Favourite
Ok here is a Devil’s Advocate argument for what they are doing (please note that does not mean I am in favour of it).
Firstly, it is clear JF has no idea about how pre-season friendlies are looked at by many regular supporters – but I am not sure that is the point here at all – nor is it necessarily whether they sell out or not.
They already know that there is probably a firm regular fan base of around at least 12k or so based on ST holders and those who regularly have medium/high home or away points. What they are trying to gauge is how many extra are out there who complain that they cannot get in just because of the points system. By offering points for games where they know attendances are traditionally low (and many regulars do not attend) – these “extra” supporters have no argument that they cannot get the initial points required to give them the chance (however remote) to attend Premier League matches. Therefore, by monitoring the number of new (or returning) “local” sign ups they are probably hoping to get an idea if this number is 1k of supporters or 5k of supporters. This can then be taken into account when deciding if the potential is there to justify a new stadium build or just an expansion.
So, if the attendance for one of the friendlies is say 8,000 then this can be indicative in terms of breakdown for considering future development – e.g.
4,000 regulars, 2,000 holiday makers, 2,000 new locals – not so good.
2,000 regulars, 2,000 holiday makers, 4,000 new locals – better.
And, before someone says it, I know that this is not the only thing to be taken into consideration, but it is something than I can see a logic behind in the minds of the money people.
In respect of points going forward, I cannot see how this will immediately affect current points holders except for the number of tickets held back for the random 1 point ballots, as long as the points drop is structured properly. As has been said before, there were games last season that dropped to low points numbers.
I am already regretting the idea of posting this - but it was just to give a possible reason I came up with as I was trying to work out the logic behind what they were doing.
Firstly, it is clear JF has no idea about how pre-season friendlies are looked at by many regular supporters – but I am not sure that is the point here at all – nor is it necessarily whether they sell out or not.
They already know that there is probably a firm regular fan base of around at least 12k or so based on ST holders and those who regularly have medium/high home or away points. What they are trying to gauge is how many extra are out there who complain that they cannot get in just because of the points system. By offering points for games where they know attendances are traditionally low (and many regulars do not attend) – these “extra” supporters have no argument that they cannot get the initial points required to give them the chance (however remote) to attend Premier League matches. Therefore, by monitoring the number of new (or returning) “local” sign ups they are probably hoping to get an idea if this number is 1k of supporters or 5k of supporters. This can then be taken into account when deciding if the potential is there to justify a new stadium build or just an expansion.
So, if the attendance for one of the friendlies is say 8,000 then this can be indicative in terms of breakdown for considering future development – e.g.
4,000 regulars, 2,000 holiday makers, 2,000 new locals – not so good.
2,000 regulars, 2,000 holiday makers, 4,000 new locals – better.
And, before someone says it, I know that this is not the only thing to be taken into consideration, but it is something than I can see a logic behind in the minds of the money people.
In respect of points going forward, I cannot see how this will immediately affect current points holders except for the number of tickets held back for the random 1 point ballots, as long as the points drop is structured properly. As has been said before, there were games last season that dropped to low points numbers.
I am already regretting the idea of posting this - but it was just to give a possible reason I came up with as I was trying to work out the logic behind what they were doing.
yanh_
First Team
Exactly this, there are lots of people who would attend if booking was less complex and they could stand a chance of sitting with their friends and family however they aren't going to be interested in going if they have to sit on their own.
Also as many OP have said using the friendlies to gauge additional demand is not really a valid approach as due to their non competitive nature they are of far less interest to most.
As a maximum points holder, I had 19 at the start of this ticketing season, I felt I had to buy a ticket last night for one of the friendlies. I wasn't going to go. I feel aggrieved that I had to buy one.
I'll probably go to watch one of the women's games to get another point.
It took me such a long time to get that first point, I couldn't get one for the first 3 years in the PL though I attended several L2, L1 and Championship games.
Now they're potentially dishing out 7 over the season and encouraging a mad scramble on a Cherries Tuesday.
Whilst it's great for those people on zero points etc. , if it becomes too much hassle to get match tickets I'll have to reconsider if I want to go through the hoops.
Is it to determine the interest in this area to attend an EPL match, where there's a population of 1/2 million people in the Poole, Bournemouth and Christchurch conurbation that the club is doing this? I don't know.
All I remember are the regular 16,000+ attendances in the John Bond era with occasional sell outs of 25,000 against teams like Villa.
I've ameliorated the 20.8% (non-season) ticket increase by moving away from my regular seat in a central block in the Main stand to a cheaper area.
I'm just wondering what Jim Fevrola and the Marketing Team will cook up next.
And one extra thing I was going to say, this is for a stadium that holds about 10,400 attendees. Of those say 6,000 ST holders, 1,500-1,800 away supporters.
One mad scramble for about 2,600 seats maximum.
As an aside, it's always disappointing to see so many empty seats during a match. What's going on? If ST holders aren't attending on a regular basis I hope the club flags that up to them.
One mad scramble for about 2,600 seats maximum.
As an aside, it's always disappointing to see so many empty seats during a match. What's going on? If ST holders aren't attending on a regular basis I hope the club flags that up to them.
DJ
Moderator
There's always going to be the odd seat dotted about by ticket holders who have a change of plans last minute. Any large sections that are empty (say block 1) tends to be comps, hospitality etc.
red_house
UTC Legend
It won't immediately affect those in the top points bracket this season other than creating a massive scramble at 10am on a Tuesday.
The issue it appears is next season as pointed out by andyred. If you miss a couple of games this season and don't do the 7 pre season friendlies / womens games etc then next season you could potentially fall off the bandwagon.
It's been confirmed the club sold out on 10 points+ don't think that's ever happened before. That indicates quite a few seats are being held back but there will be people who worked their way to 10 plus points over several years who may not see another match next season.
In short people are being forced into going to the ladies games / friendlies or risk lowering their points total.
Points should be based on league games not some sort of publicity stunt or marketing exercise.
RobTrent
UTC Legend
I think it helps to try and understand it from their perspective.
kirsikka
UTC Legend
They can't really win, to be honest. Not until they have a larger stadium. I know it annoys many, but at least they're trying to find a solution to spread the tickets out a bit rather than them all always being reserved for the same subset. Those people saying they may drift away, the same applies to those who never get to go.
However, they've called the preseason friendly thing badly.
Can any of our US friends comment on preseason friendlies over there? Do they sell out? Maybe they're part of the whole season event whereas here they're watching a kickabout where you get to see some football and catch up with some old friends. However, the football is poor quality, no matter the opposition as no team is properly committed in these games and so a lot of people skip them.
I'll watch a sketchy YouTube stream of a preseason friendly with commentary from the great western wind on the mic because I'm one of a small number of lunatics. Most people aren't like that, and that doesn't mean they wouldn't come to watch matches if there was a larger stadium available.
If they're that desperate to find a way to measure excess demand, why not have a paid membership scheme with 500 tickets reserved for each match and issued by ballot for those that choose to enter the ballot for that match as a short term measure? The paid scheme is fairly common at other clubs and would give a much better guide to those with genuine interest beyond being simply casual.
Over and above whatever numbers they got in that scheme, they'd be a lot of other demand for people that find things like that tricky (there would undoubtedly be huge grumbling about it from some) due to circumstances, personality, timing etc. Then the more casual fans on top.
However, they've called the preseason friendly thing badly.
Can any of our US friends comment on preseason friendlies over there? Do they sell out? Maybe they're part of the whole season event whereas here they're watching a kickabout where you get to see some football and catch up with some old friends. However, the football is poor quality, no matter the opposition as no team is properly committed in these games and so a lot of people skip them.
I'll watch a sketchy YouTube stream of a preseason friendly with commentary from the great western wind on the mic because I'm one of a small number of lunatics. Most people aren't like that, and that doesn't mean they wouldn't come to watch matches if there was a larger stadium available.
If they're that desperate to find a way to measure excess demand, why not have a paid membership scheme with 500 tickets reserved for each match and issued by ballot for those that choose to enter the ballot for that match as a short term measure? The paid scheme is fairly common at other clubs and would give a much better guide to those with genuine interest beyond being simply casual.
Over and above whatever numbers they got in that scheme, they'd be a lot of other demand for people that find things like that tricky (there would undoubtedly be huge grumbling about it from some) due to circumstances, personality, timing etc. Then the more casual fans on top.
On this specific point, it's known (on here at least) that the IT has always seemed relatively poor and inconsistent on the ticketing site. I've regularly had the linked account problem that you describe with friends accounts, but in contrast to your experience, a season or two ago I was able to set up linked accounts for my young kids without providing an email address - they function as linked accounts and I've bought tickets using them (away last season and for Lorient this season). Yet, when it seems they've made steps forward, things that should be so easy/obvious, like being able to navigate to the shopping basket when you click on the symbol, just don't work.
IT nitpicking aside, I'd echo the point that others seem to be making - i.e. whether you are a longstanding high points holder, or a complete newbie, the obscure process and IT demons are naturally going to end up excluding people that otherwise could try to go to games. Unless they resolve those issues, they will always have a limited view of potential capacity requirements for a new ground.
red_house
UTC Legend
Increase the database, attract those who thought it was a lost cause, all marketing I guess for a 'potential' new stadium. Every new points holder is a new E Mail address to spread the word, sell stuff, make more people feel they're involved.
The problem is these new customers (many of whom will be old fans) will very quickly become disillusioned all over again. If they get a seat on cherries tuesday enjoy sitting on your own in a shed with no family or friends, no beer, no TV's in the concourses, extremely poor and limited toilet facilities but you can gush at the excitement of it all.
Then find out your now 8 points (having done the friendlies )will never get you back in this season and it quickly becomes apparent to you the stadium, despite the new paint and rah rah bollox still isn't fit for purpose as we've all known for years.
Reading those tweets am I seeing a potential back down on the stadium ? If so just replace the Ted Mac with a bigger temp stand like the Putney End with 6k and get on with it ffs.
