Luxury Players......

I would say that the only regular player I wouldn't miss is Jack Wilshere. I think for a player who's played at the top levels of the game he doesn't contribute enough any more so I consider him a luxury. There are one or two others that are borderline luxury, Brooks and Stan with their injuries, but both can have an impact when fit.
 
Waz afcb said:
You are ignoring the fact that it’s possible for a player to provide direct goal contributions and at the same time bust a gut while not in possession. Watch the top three teams in the league, not a player there with as much natural talent as Danjuma (Buendia aside.) Maybe every left back looks poor because they are left constantly isolated by him!
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No you're just focusing on what Danjuma doesn't do well .......are we judging all our players like that?.....Solanke"s lack of goals is countered by his work rate and the things he does well....why is Danjuma any different...if he keeps winning games for us he's an essential player whether you think he works hard enough or not.
 
I would say a luxury player is one who gets away doing something you would normally ask from a player in that position because they can't do it, but you accommodate them because the excel in an other aspect that you think will get better results.

For me Billing is a luxury when he's in a deeper midfield 2, because you're accepting what he can't do well for those other moments. As a 10 though he's isn't a luxury because that role is all about being attack focused and not having to be defensively solid.

Danjuma? Hmmm. I am not sure scoring match winners makes him more 'essential' and you can still be essential and a luxury. That's why managers risk luxury players because they believe they are essential to success. Maybe best example is Liverpool and Firmino. So in Danjuma's case, it's just proves the managers right in giving him licence to get forward. But if he can track back but isn't being asked to do so, then is he a luxury? Or is that just the system?
 
Topfarrier said:
No you're just focusing on what Danjuma doesn't do well .......are we judging all our players like that?.....Solanke"s lack of goals is countered by his work rate and the things he does well....why is Danjuma any different...if he keeps winning games for us he's an essential player whether you think he works hard enough or not.
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Did you miss me saying that he does have undoubted quality? Not denying for a second that he isn’t a very talented player, he clearly is. Just raising the point that there’s an argument to made that hard work is essential at this level.
 
ChampagneCherry said:
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For me Billing is a luxury when he's in a deeper midfield 2, because you're accepting what he can't do well for those other moments. As a 10 though he's isn't a luxury because that role is all about being attack focused and not having to be defensively solid.
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Aren't you just describing playing someone out of position?

Playing Solanke in goal makes him a luxury player because you're accepting his shot stopping is a bit weak but play him up front and he's no longer a luxury because the role isn't about shot stopping.
 
Waz afcb said:
Did you miss me saying that he does have undoubted quality? Not denying for a second that he isn’t a very talented player, he clearly is. Just raising the point that there’s an argument to made that hard work is essential at this level.
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Just because a forward isn't tracking back doesn't mean he isn't working hard.....if Danjuma wasn't making forward runs you could say he wasn't putting in a shift .......he is playing as a wide forward not a winger btw...you keep comparing him with Pugh ...it's pointless...it's two different positions.....for all you know you could be criticising him for not doing something he isn't being asked to do.....I'm pretty sure that if he was supposed to have more defensive duties he'd have to do them.
 
Topfarrier said:
Just because a forward isn't tracking back doesn't mean he isn't working hard.....if Danjuma wasn't making forward runs you could say he wasn't putting in a shift .......he is playing as a wide forward not a winger btw...you keep comparing him with Pugh ...it's pointless...it's two different positions.....for all you know you could be criticising him for not doing something he isn't being asked to do.....I'm pretty ure that if he was supposed to have more defensive duties he'd have to do them.
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Semantics I know, but a wide forward is a winger.
 
Neil Dawson said:
Seems we all have different definitions of luxury players.

To me it’s someone who is in a side for rare moments of brilliance with the boss and teammates accepting a lack of hard work and defensive diligence for the points, genius and win bonuses they bring.

David Ginola was the ultimate one for me. Stan and Dom are hard working so don’t fall into this category despite what people may think of their output. Danjuma is the closest we have which is why we whinge about our two left backs all the time!
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Agree with this. I would add that you usually have to set up the team a certain way to accommodate them too.

Matt Le Tissier another example from a similar era
 
MB1980 said:
Semantics I know, but a wide forward is a winger.
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It's not really.....there's a big difference between playing as a winger in a 442 or even 451 ......the whole point of playing 433 is that you're playing with 3 forwards.....if the two wide players in that system are not playing as such then we might as well go back to playing 442.
 
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Ro Ro might be considered a luxury player although we haven't seen that much of him to judge.
 
They are ALL Luxury players....look at the fuggin wages.....
... joking aside......a team comprises of all types of player.. ball artists, hardmen, pacemen, leaders ...you need a few of each for success ...then there is the teamwork and game management...adapting to setbacks...and the fringe players who haven't yet made it...need to be kept keen and ready to grasp any opportunity.
John Bond was good at assembling a varied mix of players...and Harry......and you could even say that Eddie took it further and longer - the evidence of his Era...but of course the Game of Football and its Financial circumstances had changed so much...its harder for Any Manager now...in Any division...especially the top two.

Luxury players ?....always another Gamble...once we've define exactly what that means!
 
Topfarrier said:
We all want Solanke to do well....he works so hard it's hard not to like him but he just doesn't score enough goals and as I've said he doesn't score goals that really matter.
I hoped that a year in the Championship would do him the power of good ....he'd get 20 odd goals and kick on for us in the PL......as it stands I don't see him doing any better than he did first time round.
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think he would do better than in the last prem season but still maybe not enough for us. A long way from the finished article for sure but my point is that can’t judge him on goals scored alone. His contribution is beyond that.
 
Old Cherry said:
They are ALL Luxury players....look at the fuggin wages.....
... joking aside......a team comprises of all types of player.. ball artists, hardmen, pacemen, leaders ...you need a few of each for success ...then there is the teamwork and game management...adapting to setbacks...and the fringe players who haven't yet made it...need to be kept keen and ready to grasp any opportunity.
John Bond was good at assembling a varied mix of players...and Harry......and you could even say that Eddie took it further and longer - the evidence of his Era...but of course the Game of Football and its Financial circumstances had changed so much...its harder for Any Manager now...in Any division...especially the top two.

Luxury players ?....always another Gamble...once we've define exactly what that means!
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Plenty of different ways of interpreting history of course eg John bond’s third division team - expensively assembled and highly paid that blew promotion that should have been a formality?
 
Topfarrier said:
It's not really.....there's a big difference between playing as a winger in a 442 or even 451 ......the whole point of playing 433 is that you're playing with 3 forwards.....if the two wide players in that system are not playing as such then we might as well go back to playing 442.
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There is a big difference, but they're both wingers.
 
Topfarrier said:
After Jimnnina labelled Stan a 'Luxury player' I began to think what exactly that means....is it a player that we could do without perhaps?
I had a look though Stans and Danjuma's (another player that who's output has been questioned by some on here ) goals this season and also those of Solanke a player who wouldn't be regarded as a Luxury....I mean he works hard right?.......they've all scored pretty much the same amount of goals but Danjuma has scored 5 winners and Stan has 3 clean winners to his name .....that's two players who step up in tight games imo.
How many of Solanke"s goals have won us games btw.....yep that's right...none.
So which of those 3 players could we do without?
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Any goal will help us to win games. Its daft to just write them off.
 
Topfarrier said:
Just because a forward isn't tracking back doesn't mean he isn't working hard.....if Danjuma wasn't making forward runs you could say he wasn't putting in a shift .......he is playing as a wide forward not a winger btw...you keep comparing him with Pugh ...it's pointless...it's two different positions.....for all you know you could be criticising him for not doing something he isn't being asked to do.....I'm pretty sure that if he was supposed to have more defensive duties he'd have to do them.
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Hmmmm from what I can see Danjuma spends most of his time dropping deep into the left midfield position and drives at his opponent from deep, exactly the same role that Pugh played for us.... it just seems like an excuse you make for his lack of work off the ball tbh. And you think that he may have been asked to not put in a shift defensively? What manager would possibly tell a player that they don’t have to put in a defensive shift, especially at this level? I would say that is very unlikely and if it is true then Woodgate/Tindal are even more incompetent than first feared. I don’t see what the issue is tbh, we both agree that he is a very good footballer for the level we are at, there’s no denying that. Just making the very valid point that at this level it isn’t enough on its own. Hence why despite having one of the best squads in the league there is a very realistic possibility that we won’t even make the play offs.
 
If...we don't go up in the play-offs..or don't make them even....what then will be the summary of this situation ? about this " best squad ever assembled" ..."best squad ever seen outside the PL" ...or any other naively constructed 'crap' from posters that see football 'on paper'...not grass !..and swung over by pundits, press and Money issues !
I really despair at the trains of thought gathered up by some fans since we went up in 2015.....
.Results and Tables tell the Stories.

Think seriously before ripping up JT and JWs short reigns if it goes further pear -shaped .
 
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