Non - Can This Bloke Become President Of The United States?

Toronto John said:
Yeah, if you had a clean sheet of paper, you might draw it up that way. But something that has been in place since 1791 is a lot more difficult to move the needle, and as you have pointed out, requires a strong majority
An amendment may be proposed by a two-thirds vote of both Houses of Congress, or, if two-thirds of the States request one, by a convention called for that purpose. The amendment must then be ratified by three-fourths of the State legislatures, or three-fourths of conventions called in each State for ratification.
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Australians had the right for a long time as well. A mass shooting made them change the laws, and under a conservative prime minister as well.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/what-c...shooting-teach-us-about-guns-and-gun-control/
 
Def_II_Royalz said:
Well let's not rule out that the incident was not reported to police at the time for the usual reasons that so many sexual assaults go unreported. I could reel them off but do I need to, really?
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I've no idea if he did it or not, what I'm saying is that he hasn't been convicted of it. He's been found guilty in a civil court which has a lower burden of proof. Hence why it's an important distinction to make.
 
SlowDownDerek said:
No, I am asking you. Would you give up your car to protect children?
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Yes I would, thought i made that clear in my reply? I swear you dont even read some of the things when you reply to them or somehow dont understand them.

However, my reasons fall outside of your question and its not comparable to the gun question.
 
Druss_the_Legend said:
Yes I would, thought i made that clear in my reply? I swear you dont even read some of the things when you reply to them or somehow dont understand them.

However, my reasons fall outside of your question and its not comparable to the gun question.
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Have you given your car up then? It is comparable to gun control in that it is a freedom that involves risk to third parties.
 
ErikthViking said:
There is an 'anyone but Trump' majority in the USA. That majority was seven million votes in 2020 and will be greater in 2024 if Trump should be the Republican candidate.

Trump is a convicted and self-admitted sexual abuser. Moderate Republicans are becoming sickened and repulsed.

Trump is soon to be indicted for his attempted election subversion in Georgia not to mention the 34 criminal counts related to the hush money payment to Stormy Daniels.

Trump only remains popular amongst the conspiracy theorists, the gun nuts and racists.

Trump managed to lie his way through once, but will not a second time. Pete Townshend got it right, Won't Get Fooled Again.
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Try not to believe all the media hype, I am out here in rural flyover country and not all the folk you have stereotyped are rampant rednecks. On a side note, it was possible most of their older relatives who ran up the Normandy beaches along with our Brit and Commonwealth soldiers to save your freedoms to be able spew your alleged Trump Derangement Syndrome (TDS) prejudiced comments.

BTW, Was Bill Clinton as clean as driven snow ?
 
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There is so much miss information and complete bs stories from both sides I don’t watch any media anymore as it’s all feelings and opinions the truth has long gone from journalism.
As for trump not sure if he can win or not but Biden certainly has not been very convincing for the Dems.
As for guns most Americans simply don’t want a ban wether you are republicans or a dem.they want the right to bear arms and do not trust a government to stop once they start changing the constitution. You say Americans are obsessed by guns yet I see them discussed on here more than I do here in Pa which is very pro gun.
there was a ban during Bills term on so called Assault rifles and im not sure it made a difference.there is a severe mental health problem and lack of resources to deal with it or to even want to deal with it.
 
I think around 80million Americans own gun and very few become criminals or a murder.
as for gun deaths most are committed by illegal guns and are gang on gang and no ban is going to stop that. Class A drugs are illegal
And can be found everywhere and are smuggled in as are many guns. Drug gangs in large cities are a serious concern but no one seems to know how to stop them or care as again it mainly happens in poor areas and politicians simply don’t care like in most places the poor have no voice. Would a ban on Ar 15 reduce mass shooting maybe but no one knows for sure and it don’t believe it did when last enacted. Firearms are used often for self defense here in USA and that can’t be made light of. They Uk has serious gun restrictions but overall gun crime/deaths is no lower than before when u could own anything. A shotgun certificate is actually very easy to get even with a record believe it or not.
I think gun ownership in USA will start to go down in 30+ years as younger generations simply don’t have that interest though I could be wrong. Violent crime and murders is actually way lower now than the 80’s and 90’s.
Tbh I think the western world in gen seems to ready to implode and I’m not sure what the next decade has in store for us but ain’t good
 
Druss_the_Legend said:
Yeah appreciate he lost a house in the mid terms. My issue is his failure to even attempt to make gun law changes when he had both. Same with Obama. Easy to talk the talk but when it comes to it, both parties are too beholden to the gun community.
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Most Americans don’t want a change though so why would either side go forward with something that’s not popular. NRA contributes to some candidates but the amount pales when compared to other groups and they don’t get someone in power that up to to voters. As Ive said I live in a area where everyone owns guns wether a dem or republican but it’s def not the deciding factor when they vote
 
I think Sam and I would be the first to admit we completely disagree on the issue of gun ownership, but I do agree that the asinine media treatment of all the hot topic issues that reduces everything to binaries and creates a geographical picture of America that reduces everyone to one or another of two kinds of people based on where they live is really destructive and negates the complexity held in everyone. For instance one such complexity is to believe, as I do, that Trump is a total cnut AND so is Bill Clinton.

I've been all over America. I personally wouldn't choose to live in a rural area, but I also recognise that rural areas contain multitudes.

sam adams said:
Try not to believe all the media hype, I am out here in rural flyover country and not all the folk you have stereotyped are rampant rednecks. On a side note, it was possible most of their older relatives who ran up the Normandy beaches along with our Brit and Commonwealth soldiers to save your freedoms to be able spew your alleged Trump Derangement Syndrome (TDS) prejudiced comments.

BTW, Was Bill Clinton as clean as driven snow ?
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I have always been "conservative" but the problem as I see it, very similar to @Def_II_Royalz, is that party lines seem to override issues. Even local issues that fall under "states rights" often get lost in the greater binary dynamic.

I think I have said it before on here, no political party actually speaks for what I personally stand for. In fact, I can pick items from every platform that represent my views. So what does that look like when I head to the ballot box ........... a stew that does not satisfy. Without issues to vote for and being sketical of election promises anyway, it is hold your nose and pick the least reprehensible of the bunch. Or, vote for change just because the guys who have been in power have been complete F**k-ups.

Man, you wonder why it's all headed for the sh*thole? So, spend your money on good times, concerts and friends .........
 
Well a few things going on here. 1. cars weren't invented with the sole purpose of killing, maiming and menacing people. 2. Modern life has made unfortunately made car ownership the curse and necessity of existence. The pitiful lack of public transport options in our very own beloved Bournemouth is a pretty obvious example.

Some disconnected thoughts that are a bit all over the place as I find this subject extremely emotive:

If anyone here was at Bournemouth School when Dunblane happened, you may well have membered Alan Petrie weeping on stage during morning assembly as he had some association with that school. Whilst the UK has always had a different relationship to gun ownership and the laws surrounding it, it was enough to shock the public and government into doing something about it.

What I've been feeling and seeing in others in my time here in the US is the sheer amount of exasperation and disillusionment that common sense and love and life will never, ever get close to challenging the industrial complex that supports the production and sale of guns. I simply want the right to send my son to school in a world where he does not have to do school shooter safety drills. I don't think guns will ever be banned here. But that nothing can be done to increase background checks on gun license applications and extend licensing restrictions to all kinds of gun (for instance NY state doesn't require a permit for shotguns and manual operated rifles) is a huge stain on this country.

To be honest, going back to the car analogue, the way some people drive these days (he says as he further lapses into middle age), it would make a lot of sense to tighten up and make more stringent the regulations surrounding testing. My driver's test took about 10 minutes if that, AND I accidentally went forwards instead of backwards during my parallel park (took the test in an automatic, which threw me, ahem), which would be an instant fail pretty much everywhere else. The instructor didn't bat an eyelid.

Car culture has gotten really out of control here. The manufacturers know they're trading in the dying embers of what they once knew and are going all out. Cars have become far too powerful for practical purposes. Every other advert either depicts cars on race tracks, or flying through the air like fcuking Transformers or people driving like idiots. What are they selling and to who? It's interesting the gun/car equivalency has come up on this forum. Both seem like a truly existential matter to a certain kind of person who feels they have precious few other hills to die on.


SlowDownDerek said:
Have you given your car up then? It is comparable to gun control in that it is a freedom that involves risk to third parties.
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Toronto John said:
I have always been "conservative" but the problem as I see it, very similar to @Def_II_Royalz, is that party lines seem to override issues. Even local issues that fall under "states rights" often get lost in the greater binary dynamic.

I think I have said it before on here, no political party actually speaks for what I personally stand for. In fact, I can pick items from every platform that represent my views. So what does that look like when I head to the ballot box ........... a stew that does not satisfy. Without issues to vote for and being sketical of election promises anyway, it is hold your nose and pick the least reprehensible of the bunch. Or, vote for change just because the guys who have been in power have been complete F**k-ups.

Man, you wonder why it's all headed for the sh*thole? So, spend your money on good times, concerts and friends .........
Click to expand...


couldn't agree more with you. I’m also conservative and find myself lean more towards Libertarian but even then it’s mix of what I like and dislike. Doesn’t seem to matter who gets in they are all self serving and couldn’t care less about the people and as you say just enjoy your life and forget all about politics and media etc
 
Yes, I understand that. And I agree your point stands. But I wasn't asking you if you thought he had done it or not: there's a wider picture that involves power dynamics and violence towards and subjugation of women throughout history, which made your "lower burden of proof" comment stick out as a bit reductive.

SlowDownDerek said:
I've no idea if he did it or not, what I'm saying is that he hasn't been convicted of it. He's been found guilty in a civil court which has a lower burden of proof. Hence why it's an important distinction to make.
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Def_II_Royalz said:
Well a few things going on here. 1. cars weren't invented with the sole purpose of killing, maiming and menacing people. 2. Modern life has made unfortunately made car ownership the curse and necessity of existence. The pitiful lack of public transport options in our very own beloved Bournemouth is a pretty obvious example.

Some disconnected thoughts that are a bit all over the place as I find this subject extremely emotive:

If anyone here was at Bournemouth School when Dunblane happened, you may well have membered Alan Petrie weeping on stage during morning assembly as he had some association with that school. Whilst the UK has always had a different relationship to gun ownership and the laws surrounding it, it was enough to shock the public and government into doing something about it.

What I've been feeling and seeing in others in my time here in the US is the sheer amount of exasperation and disillusionment that common sense and love and life will never, ever get close to challenging the industrial complex that supports the production and sale of guns. I simply want the right to send my son to school in a world where he does not have to do school shooter safety drills. I don't think guns will ever be banned here. But that nothing can be done to increase background checks on gun license applications and extend licensing restrictions to all kinds of gun (for instance NY state doesn't require a permit for shotguns and manual operated rifles) is a huge stain on this country.

To be honest, going back to the car analogue, the way some people drive these days (he says as he further lapses into middle age), it would make a lot of sense to tighten up and make more stringent the regulations surrounding testing. My driver's test took about 10 minutes if that, AND I accidentally went forwards instead of backwards during my parallel park (took the test in an automatic, which threw me, ahem), which would be an instant fail pretty much everywhere else. The instructor didn't bat an eyelid.

Car culture has gotten really out of control here. The manufacturers know they're trading in the dying embers of what they once knew and are going all out. Cars have become far too powerful for practical purposes. Every other advert either depicts cars on race tracks, or flying through the air like fcuking Transformers or people driving like idiots. What are they selling and to who? It's interesting the gun/car equivalency has come up on this forum. Both seem like a truly existential matter to a certain kind of person who feels they have precious few other hills to die on.
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Agree with most of this. Tbh I only brought it up because druss was trying to suggest pro-gun people are happy to let kids die. A silly point that I felt deserved a silly response.

As I've said I am happy with the relationship we have with guns in this country and think Americans are absolutely crazy to continually try to justify how they do it there but ... it's their country and I don't see why people in the UK get so vexed about it. Obviously in your case this doesn't apply.

What seems weird to me is how the 'freedoms' that are seen as so important in America are so geared towards what is commercial advantageous to the country. Guns are profitable and so require personal freedoms, drugs potentially reduce productivity so they are not an important personal freedom.
 
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