Gary O'Neil

[SlowDownDerek]

Spot on. There was an understandable question about how good we could be in the summer but once the season started going and the standard of the bottom 10 or so became apparent there was no doubt we should have been very comfortable. The protracted manager chase debacle and then slow resettle derailed us badly as either side of this results have been good enough.

The entire club was for sale going onto our first PL campaign in three years. Of course this derailed the season. We're one of the best placed teams out of the relegation threatened sides despite a restricted summer transfer window for obvious reasons.

If people think we should have been comfortably safe by now despite the upheaval I suggest the issue is with their level of expectations.

 

[New Old Cherry]

This has been a strange season ...a sea - change at the top with Newcastle and to a lesser extent Brighton and Brentford making waves...and Liverpool, Chelsea and Spurs faltering quite badly.
The start of the PL concept imploding ?... and with the spectre of a 'Super League' hanging ominously above....yet probably attractive to Manchester United.
Even SuperSaints drag-assing is quite a surprise ..albeit exceedingly pleasant for tribes west of Brockenhurst gathering gleefully at Longham Bridge.
You could say the Cherries are slightly lucky that there are 8/9 clubs in the mix.....but then the quality of the much bigger Elland Road outfit is probably less...likewise Forest...add them to Saints....and the equation is developed neatly !

 

[Neil Dawson]

The entire club was for sale going onto our first PL campaign in three years. Of course this derailed the season. We're one of the best placed teams out of the relegation threatened sides despite a restricted summer transfer window for obvious reasons.

If people think we should have been comfortably safe by now despite the upheaval I suggest the issue is with their level of expectations.

Within a few months of promotion we had beaten Villa, Forest, Leicester and Everton and drawn with Newcastle, Brentford and Wolves. Nothing in that tells you this isn’t a team that could have survived comfortably ( by this I mean being on around 40 points by now… which had we beaten two of Saints, Forest, Wolves and Palace at home we would be) If you can’t see that as a possiblilty I’d agree with you the issue is with your level of expectations.

 

[CherryBare]

Within a few months of promotion we had beaten Villa, Forest, Leicester and Everton and drawn with Newcastle, Brentford and Wolves. Nothing in that tells you this isn’t a team that could have survived comfortably ( by this I mean being on around 40 points by now… which had we beaten two of Saints, Forest, Wolves and Palace at home we would be) If you can’t see that as a possiblilty I’d agree with you the issue is with your level of expectations.

Yes then tavs, dom and neto got injured and we saw how thin our squad was

 

[richnrg]

Within a few months of promotion we had beaten Villa, Forest, Leicester and Everton and drawn with Newcastle, Brentford and Wolves. Nothing in that tells you this isn’t a team that could have survived comfortably ( by this I mean being on around 40 points by now… which had we beaten two of Saints, Forest, Wolves and Palace at home we would be) If you can’t see that as a possiblilty I’d agree with you the issue is with your level of expectations.

I agree that we COULD have survived comfotably, but you seemed to be suggesting that we SHOULD have survived comfortably, which is different. 40 points is 11th at the moment. We might have hoped to be there now, but I doubt if too many expected it (Neil excluded )

 

[SlowDownDerek]

Within a few months of promotion we had beaten Villa, Forest, Leicester and Everton and drawn with Newcastle, Brentford and Wolves. Nothing in that tells you this isn’t a team that could have survived comfortably ( by this I mean being on around 40 points by now… which had we beaten two of Saints, Forest, Wolves and Palace at home we would be) If you can’t see that as a possiblilty I’d agree with you the issue is with your level of expectations.

O'Neil won most of those games. We got loads of key injuries and had a very thin squad for obvious reasons. Out of interest, what were your expectations going into the season? 40 points after 32 games? I think you're crazy.

O'Neil is obviously no world beater but I'm not sure that any of the other available managers would have done loads better given the same resources. I think you've got an unrealistically positive view of the quality of our squad going into the season. You know the one you said was poor because the board didn't sign enough players.

 

[beds cherry]

I recommend 'Dead Man's Shoes', which is filmed/based in Matlock, Derbyshire.

F**ked up film, 'ard hitting for sure... not one for delicate souls, that's for sure. It is superb though:

'Richard returns to his home town of Matlock, Derbyshire, in the Peak District, England, after serving in the British Army. He and his younger, mentally impaired brother, Anthony, camp at an abandoned farm near the town. Flashbacks reveal Anthony's abuse by a group of drug dealers in the town; Richard vows to take revenge. '

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0419677/

YOU Y'CNUT!!!!

Genuinely unnerving..

 

[Topfarrier]

Just wanted to point out that Coventry have the third lowest budget in the Championship yet Mark Robins has them in the play off places......if they can compete against vastly more expensive squads why is it impossible for us to do so?.......merely surviving by the skin of our teeth isn't a massive achievement despite what the patronising pundits say.

 

[New Old Cherry]

Just wanted to point out that Coventry have the third lowest budget in the Championship yet Mark Robins has them in the play off places......if they can compete against vastly more expensive squads why is it impossible for us to do so?.......merely surviving by the skin of our teeth isn't a massive achievement despite what the patronising pundits say.

That's judging it by MONEY....maybe Coventry's players were by chance better than their fees suggest....and other teams players over - valued.
It's all bollux.
How the f√ck can any player be sanely attributed an accurate 'value'.....when you can't guarantee how he will perform in a given set of games...especially in a new and different environment than his previous club.
Fans need to do more introspection on how they approach analysing what goes on.
Football is probably among the most inexact sciences on the Planet !

 

[Neil Dawson]

[

O'Neil won most of those games. We got loads of key injuries and had a very thin squad for obvious reasons. Out of interest, what were your expectations going into the season? 40 points after 32 games? I think you're crazy.

O'Neil is obviously no world beater but I'm not sure that any of the other available managers would have done loads better given the same resources. I think you've got an unrealistically positive view of the quality of our squad going into the season. You know the one you said was poor because the board didn't sign enough players.

Like I said earlier… in the summer none of us knew what to expect really. Once we saw it though it wasn’t anything to worry about. The core of the squad as you know I’ve said many times was excellent but of course we needed signings like all sides.

My frustration with this season has always been because I don’t think we have maximised the players we have through inexperienced management and I don’t think as a unit the 11 signings we have made have been effective. I know your opinion differs on this and I respect that so why not leave the debate at that for once so you don’t take over another thread.

 

[Topfarrier]

That's judging it by MONEY....maybe Coventry's players were by chance better than their fees suggest....and other teams players over - valued.
It's all bollux.
How the f√ck can any player be sanely attributed an accurate 'value'.....when you can't guarantee how he will perform in a given set of games...especially in a new and different environment than his previous club.
Fans need to do more introspection on how they approach analysing what goes on.
Football is probably among the most inexact sciences on the Planet !

So you're agreeing with me then......there's no reason why we can't do anything better than just surviving.

 

[SlowDownDerek]

[

Like I said earlier… in the summer none of us knew what to expect really. Once we saw it though it wasn’t anything to worry about. The core of the squad as you know I’ve said many times was excellent but of course we needed signings like all sides.

My frustration with this season has always been because I don’t think we have maximised the players we have through inexperienced management and I don’t think as a unit the 11 signings we have made have been effective. I know your opinion differs on this and I respect that so why not leave the debate at that for once so you don’t take over another thread.

It's crazy. Your expectations of 40+ points after 32 games means you think this squad should have finished top half judging by the league table. A squad straight out of the championship which is widely accepted as having underinvestment during the summer window due to the impending sale.

Funny thing is that since we strengthened in January we have shown form that would put us comfortably top-half.

Kind of begs the question, when would you be happy with the club?

 

[Neil Dawson]

Kind of begs the question, when would you be happy with the club?

It’s simple for me. I’m happy when I think the squad are being utilised to their correct ability and barring the odd off day are lined up correctly and perform to their potential in every match. I’m less bothered about results otherwise I would never have supported us and gone for Liverpool or Man U like most people my age. There’s been plenty of seasons in all divisions I’ve been happy under the above criteria. We all look at things differently and threads would be a lot shorter if you could accept this in people if you don’t mind me saying.

You say it’s crazy to think we should have 40 points by now. We’ve got 33 with what I think we can all agree is an inexperienced manager and we didn’t beat Southampton, Wolves, Palace under Viera and Forest at home. It’s crazy to me to think we couldn’t have got 40 points but there you go!

 

[mat1981]

For me I think a number of our supporters expectations vs quality and depth of the squad are a little over the top. Whether a reasonable barometer or not is debateable but look who the bookies and "media experts" consistently tipped for relegation. It was always AFCB.

The lack of quality to come off of the bench until the January signings and returning key players-Neto, Tavernier, Solanke and as it turns out Rothwell, have made us by and large competitive since.

Somewhat agree on the a better manager could have got us a couple more points debate, specifically on sorting the obvious set piece weakness.

The ups and downs of performances though are really a consequence of the quality of the team/squad and it's availability, IMHO. There is only so much a manager can do with the talent at his disposal.

 

[nd9cherry]

Sadly, for me, we are simply too inconsistent for GON to stay on... Nice bloke but never been keen on him as the man to take us forward I've kept quiet during our decent run, observing, but performances like the first half v Fulham, BHA and WHU are the reason why he's still not for me...

Even if he keeps us up, I'd be having a word with him as soon as we're safe to say a massive thank you, we love you, we want you to stay on as coach if you're interested, and here is a nice 3 year contract as well as hefty bonus for keeping us up... However, next season we're going to bring another person in to either work with you (as coach) or replace you...

If we stay up GON will have kept us up because there are worst teams in the league, and not because we've been good enough...

That's same every season...worst teams are relegated..as we were under Eddie

 

[northstandmark]

I'd like to know what the plan is, have an identity about our play again. Knowing that whatever we do won't always work, I'm still not sure what 'the plan' for our squad is.

And ideally not have a panic attack every time we concede a corner, or be mentally scarred for months on end about losing from 2-0 up continually.

I have set out longer form points of interest that I will reserve judgement on until late May, but that's it in a nutshell for me!

 

[SlowDownDerek]

It’s simple for me. I’m happy when I think the squad are being utilised to their correct ability and barring the odd off day are lined up correctly and perform to their potential in every match. I’m less bothered about results otherwise I would never have supported us and gone for Liverpool or Man U like most people my age. There’s been plenty of seasons in all divisions I’ve been happy under the above criteria. We all look at things differently and threads would be a lot shorter if you could accept this in people if you don’t mind me saying.

You say it’s crazy to think we should have 40 points by now. We’ve got 33 with what I think we can all agree is an inexperienced manager and we didn’t beat Southampton, Wolves, Palace under Viera and Forest at home. It’s crazy to me to think we couldn’t have got 40 points but there you go!

I honestly don't think you'll ever be happy with the club, you didn't seem satisfied with things for the majority of the time under Howe given the long list of things you constantly criticised him for so I don't suppose there was any chance you'd be happy this season.

The club was sold part way through the season and we had a weak squad going into the season as a result. If he keeps us up it is a brilliant achievement no matter what. Sure we could have won games we didn't. We could have held onto two goal leads more (which I think we would have done with Neto in goal against Leeds and Spurs). We could also have lost against Liverpool, Spurs, etc. and not come back from losing positions as much.

If he fails from here it's a massive failure, such is football.

 

[Neil Dawson]

I was

I honestly don't think you'll ever be happy with the club, you didn't seem satisfied with things for the majority of the time under Howe given the long list of things you constantly criticised him for so I don't suppose there was any chance you'd be happy this season.

The club was sold part way through the season and we had a weak squad going into the season as a result. If he keeps us up it is a brilliant achievement no matter what. Sure we could have won games we didn't. We could have held onto two goal leads more (which I think we would have done with Neto in goal against Leeds and Spurs). We could also have lost against Liverpool, Spurs, etc. and not come back from losing positions as much.

If he fails from here it's a massive failure, such is football.

I’ve never been happier than under Howe so you couldn’t be more wrong. 40 points was well within reach for this squad, in my opinion, with a decent manager.

 

[TrevorMorganFanClub]

As stated before, every bookmaker had us as short odds-on favourite for relegation before the season starts.

Likewise every "expert" pundit had us finishing bottom, some even suggestion we could beat Derby's lowest points record.

The facts are that we are a couple of results from safety and yet we still have fans booing our own players during games.

 

[SlowDownDerek]

I'd like to know what the plan is, have an identity about our play again. Knowing that whatever we do won't always work, I'm still not sure what 'the plan' for our squad is.

And ideally not have a panic attack every time we concede a corner, or be mentally scarred for months on end about losing from 2-0 up continually.

I have set out longer form points of interest that I will reserve judgement on until late May, but that's it in a nutshell for me!

In many ways my opinion on whether O'Neil should be given the job is the same as whether players like Jack Stephens should be signed permanently. It depends on Foley's ambitions.

If O'Neil doesn't keep us up he should be replaced no matter what in my view. Assuming he ends up with a points total of 39-42, which is what I think will happen, he would be an okay option to try and keep the club up next season. He'll have done it before, got a reasonable tune out of the current squad, shown ability to learn (set piece defending aside) and could hopefully do better given a proper pre-season and some signings.

But if Foley genuinely wants to move the club to another level he needs to implement a proper plan with a next-level manager. Players like Stephens and, dare I say, Solanke would also need to be improved upon to get us to this next level.

Personally, as with this season, I'm not too bothered which way he goes as long as he builds us a new ground in a suitable location.