Non - Brexit

redharry said:
Shows how much he has had his hands tied.
May is toast now.
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From what I read...(very much flying by the seat of my pants) Raab's preference for this agreement depended on the customs union backstop being possible for us to unilaterally withdrawn from, should we wish in future. That was a crucial caveat in terms of the level of independence we would gain. But No.10 conceded on that, and what ended up being agreed was that we can only leave the customs union if the EU agree, or some complicated mechanism to that basic effect. Hence he's left in a huff with No.10, feeling that he can't represent this agreement.

So perhaps he's holding some principles after all.
 
DartGuru said:
Not wanting to dismiss the rest of your post, but two things...
in trade terms, Switzerland and Norway are non-entities compared to the UK, and technically the UK is not an island as it has a border with the EU in Ireland, which is the real crux of the problem. If we became GB and jettisoned Northern Ireland, Brexit itself would have been simplified, but Jimmy Crankie would have been salivating at the prosect of IndyRef2.
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See what your saying with Norway and Switzerland being non-entities in that respect ....but we Really Can't let N.Ireland or the RoI become such a thing of inflated importance getting in the way of progress. NI are incapable of even conducting an assembly of their own devolved parlaiment! These people are trouble, bigots acting up on a stage that they shouldn't be on! A border that has been brought up as a big deal but is just home to a few hedgehogs in terms of anything worth bothering about! Let's get real!
Krankie..alias Sturgeon is an altogether bigger problem for the future!...
don't wanna go there!
 
This is like watching a snake consume it's own tail.

The Tory party will NEVER agree on Europe or any facet of it. This may finally land up with new political parties emerging.
 
Druss_the_Legend said:
No one will ever agree, thats why its impossible. I dont like May but she has an impossible job as there are about 10 different versions of brexit or no brexit that people want.
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A hard Brexit seemed to be favoured by some on here. But I'm sure that, like Boris and Jacob, they didn't understand the implications.

If you did well you must be mightily frustrated now.
 
Druss_the_Legend said:
No one will ever agree, thats why its impossible. I dont like May but she has an impossible job as there are about 10 different versions of brexit or no brexit that people want.
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This completely, listening to parliament at the moment - raw democracy at its most compelling and brutal ...
 
It really is quite remarkable. The funny thing is that our politicians and parliament have been turned inside out by this whereas the EU is acting like they don't have a care in the world - not bothered a jot about how unpopular their operating model is in one of their largest member states. Quite telling.
 
Is the purpose of Labour to just down cry everything that the Conservatives do or do they have some other purpose?

Personally, I don't really like the proposed deal, but given that Labour claim to be pro-EU, isn't it sort of in their policy interests to back the PM? Certainly I can't see another realistic alternative that keeps so many ties with the EU. Staying in the EU is just not going to happen... is it?
 
SlowDownDerek said:
It really is quite remarkable. The funny thing is that our politicians and parliament have been turned inside out by this whereas the EU is acting like they don't have a care in the world - not bothered a jot about how unpopular their operating model is in one of their largest member states. Quite telling.
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Because one is democratic and faces the possibility of being chucked out on their ear once every few years.

The other know they have a job for life regardless of what any of the rabble around the continent may think.
 
Remember, none of these conniving bar steward MP's are acting in the country's interest. They're using Brexit to make their own power moves.

Of course Brexit is not a left or right issue and if Labour was in government the same chaos would be happening - they're just as screwed up.

And then you have the EU leaders... They're just the same, they're not acting in the interests of their populace either.

I understand if people feel we'd be better off economically in the EU. However, if you look objectively at how the EU has treated a nation they want to stay it is shocking. Of course the EU has form for ignoring how populations vote, we're not the first nation of people they've tried to screw.

But despite all this, suggesting its impossible to get Brexit through is just weak and naive. If we didn't do stuff cos it was a bit hard then nothing in life would be achieved.
 
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