Non - Brexit

Ivyhouse said:
Listening to the hot air coming out of my radio this morning makes me despair of the British people. What happened to tolerance and a spirit of working together. Apart from football, I know politics has always been the most divisive pastime but the way both sides are going at each other today is just wrong. 52% voted leave. They were not knuckle dragging xenaphobes as some are being depicted. 48% voted remain and their wishes should also be considered, not dismissed as ‘you lost, get over it’
Unfortunately we don’t seem to have a unifying figure who could get a deal that would satisfy everybody. They wasted 3 weeks before Christmas debating a vote that never happened. They’ve wasted another week debating a vote everybody knew was lost. Now they’re going to waste another day debating a motion that Labour themselves don’t expect to win and we pay these wastes of space how much ?
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Totally agree, there was even a rumpus over a pregnant MP who was supposed to be in hospital having a baby but had to put it off to vote on a land slide victory. Why the hell wasn't she on maternity leave?
I didn't see her today though.
 
Ivyhouse said:
Listening to the hot air coming out of my radio this morning makes me despair of the British people. What happened to tolerance and a spirit of working together. Apart from football, I know politics has always been the most divisive pastime but the way both sides are going at each other today is just wrong. 52% voted leave. They were not knuckle dragging xenaphobes as some are being depicted. 48% voted remain and their wishes should also be considered, not dismissed as ‘you lost, get over it’
Unfortunately we don’t seem to have a unifying figure who could get a deal that would satisfy everybody. They wasted 3 weeks before Christmas debating a vote that never happened. They’ve wasted another week debating a vote everybody knew was lost. Now they’re going to waste another day debating a motion that Labour themselves don’t expect to win and we pay these wastes of space how much ?
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I tend to agree with the sentiment of your post but not so sure about the 48%.

Only twice since 1935 have more than 50% of people voted for the party that formed government and far far fewer than that voted for their MP with a lower turnout than at the referendum.

It is the greatest mandate the public has given parliament in my lifetime and potentially in the history of UK democracy.

After a general election, nobody gives a toss about the 80%(my inaccurate estimate) of people who didn't vote for their MP. I'm a little bitter that I don't think I've ever had my candidate win in Europe or UK elections and nobody has pandered.

Corbyn an absolute moron for wanting to rule out "no deal". The single most basic and important rule of negotiation is to be prepared to walk away. Does he go into a car garage announcing that he won't leave without a car and wonder why he has to pay twice the advertised price?
 
Kudos said:
I tend to agree with the sentiment of your post but not so sure about the 48%.

Only twice since 1935 have more than 50% of people voted for the party that formed government and far far fewer than that voted for their MP with a lower turnout than at the referendum.

It is the greatest mandate the public has given parliament in my lifetime and potentially in the history of UK democracy.

After a general election, nobody gives a toss about the 80%(my inaccurate estimate) of people who didn't vote for their MP. I'm a little bitter that I don't think I've ever had my candidate win in Europe or UK elections and nobody has pandered.
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This is where I don't agree. A general election is different from a referendum especially when there were clearly lots of people who voted leave who didn't advocate leaving the single market. There were entire groups in the leave campaign who wanted EFTA arguably including Dan Hannan who is one of the key leave figures. The argument that "the EU went further than what you voted for in 1975" was a clear line of argument used in the referendum so suggesting that there is a mandate for 'hard brexit' is stretching the truth.

It seems that many on the hard brexit side of the debate seem to think this referendum was to decide who gets to define what leave means but it's not as simple as that.

There is a mandate to leave the EU but not necessarily a mandate for hard brexit. Compromise is the only answer.
 
Director general of British Chambers of Commerce tweets..

Another day wasted by Westminster.

No answers on the practical, real-world questions facing UK businesses.

Baffled customers, suppliers and investors around the world.

The people of this country - and the businesses that power our communities - deserve better.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/46874049

No Deal has been the default option since the Referendum, who is able to tell us what it means for the UK post 29 March ?
 
Kudos said:
I tend to agree with the sentiment of your post but not so sure about the 48%.

After a general election, nobody gives a toss about the 80%(my inaccurate estimate) of people who didn't vote for their MP.
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In a General Election the Opposition parties are there to look after the 80% and to represent their views in Parliament. With this stupid referendum unfortunately the devil takes the hind most and that in my book is not democracy. I’m in a similar situation having been born and brought up in Bournemouth where anybody remotely left of centre seems totally disenfranchised.
 
SlowDownDerek said:
There is no maternity leave for MPs.
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On paper, an MP can take maternity leave, regardless of whatever constitutional crisis is unfolding, thanks to “pairing”, where a counterpart will be found to cancel out your absence by not voting themselves. It is known as a “gentleman’s agreement”
 
Kenya Cherrie said:
On paper, an MP can take maternity leave, regardless of whatever constitutional crisis is unfolding, thanks to “pairing”, where a counterpart will be found to cancel out your absence by not voting themselves. It is known as a “gentleman’s agreement”
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As you say, ‘on paper’, but the person who went in to vote whilst heavily pregnant for the meaningful vote this week did so because they had no faith in the pairing system due to this previous failure/mistake:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-44867866
 
Ivyhouse said:
In a General Election the Opposition parties are there to look after the 80% and to represent their views in Parliament. With this stupid referendum unfortunately the devil takes the hind most and that in my book is not democracy. I’m in a similar situation having been born and brought up in Bournemouth where anybody remotely left of centre seems totally disenfranchised.
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I'm pretty sure an SNP MP from Dundee West gives even less of a toss about a left of centre voter in Bournemouth than the incumbent government.
 
On a personal basis, no, but I think if you look at the voting pattern of the SNP they would almost always have sided with Labour.
In theory your local MP, irrespective of party, should deal with any individual issues you have. On this I understand Tobias Elwood, although poles away from my own political leaning, has a pretty good reputation. Unlike my Tory incumbent known locally as the unicorn. We think he exists but nobody remembers ever seeing him.
If we had a PR system of electing our representatives, which as a Green Party member I would favour, we still wouldn’t have that personal link with our representative.
 
Jstele said:
As you say, ‘on paper’, but the person who went in to vote whilst heavily pregnant for the meaningful vote this week did so because they had no faith in the pairing system due to this previous failure/mistake:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-44867866
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But May lost by the biggest margin ever and everybody knew it was a washout beforehand. She had another agenda, with more and more women becoming MPs she wants the rules changed.
 
Kenya Cherrie said:
But May lost by the biggest margin ever and everybody knew it was a washout beforehand. She had another agenda, with more and more women becoming MPs she wants the rules changed.
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Yep, agreed. She wanted to make a point because the rules aren’t convenient for mps that are pregnant or suffering from long term illnesses. She also made the point that it wouldn’t look good on her record as it would just say that she was ‘absent’. Considering the historic nature of the vote I can see why that might bother an mp.
 
The snp anti austerity policies align closer with labour so likely to vote the same way.
The dup anti 20th century policies align closer to rees mogg european research group and so more likely to vote the same way.
 
JIMNNINA said:
The snp anti austerity policies align closer with labour so likely to vote the same way.
The dup anti 20th century policies align closer to rees mogg european research group and so more likely to vote the same way.
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True but never forget Brexit is not about one party v another.

On another MB I saw a link to a piece by Owen Jones. I normally wouldn't take any notice of him but this line caught my eye...

"...One Labour MP tells me that in a free vote the parliamentary labour party would be split down the middle, possibly with even more against (Brexit)..."

https://www.theguardian.com/comment...ter-brexit-deal-second-referendum-norway-plus
 
So May is having another vote on the brexit deal on 29 January. The deal that took 2 and a half years to arrive at. The deal that had been overwhelmingly rejected. The deal that is the final deal that can't be changed. The deal that actually doesn't say anything except open the way for 2 more years of negotiation. She wants to vote on that again. Just 2 months before the end date.

Of course. She can then say that this deal is 5h1t but the alternative is worse.

By far the most incompetent PM in our history. Shocking.
 
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