Non - Labour Party

No average worker pays half their earnings in tax, my tax is 36% after the first £300 per month. we also get allowences for travel. I pay £2 for a coffee and £3 for a beer when out.
beers cost 40p in shops. When I was in England last april, I didn't see much difference in prices.
 
DJ said:
Messing about for 8 months in opposition playing the Hokey Cokey with a pledge to see how well it will land is crap.

But it’s good practice for when they’re in power I guess.
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What pisses me off is that for the last 14 years the Tories have been stealing all of the best Labour policies in order to stay in power and Starmer’s response is to steal all of the really crap Tory policies in order to appeal to Daily Mail readers.
 
stanthevan said:
What pisses me off is that for the last 14 years the Tories have been stealing all of the best Labour policies in order to stay in power and Starmer’s response is to steal all of the really crap Tory policies in order to appeal to Daily Mail readers.
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Loads of Guardian readers can't afford EV's, solar panels and like most don't want to see £28 billion thrown at something that just appears to be trying to appease a so called green credential.

If however Labour had a clear path on what they were doing, where the money was going exactly and what it would achieve then it might make sense to voters. If this already exists can someone point me to it, I'd be genuinely interested.
 
red_house said:
Loads of Guardian readers can't afford EV's, solar panels and like most don't want to see £28 billion thrown at something that just appears to be trying to appease a so called green credential.

If however Labour had a clear path on what they were doing, where the money was going exactly and what it would achieve then it might make sense to voters. If this already exists can someone point me to it, I'd be genuinely interested.
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Because they only look as far as the end of their noses.

World's first year-long breach of key 1.5C warming limit https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-68110310
 
DJ said:
Because they only look as far as the end of their noses.

World's first year-long breach of key 1.5C warming limit https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-68110310
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This is the whole point. Both major parties want to appeal to the ostriches. People all over the world are dying in fires and floods. Pollution and famine caused by climate change is rife but hey ho, let’s vote for the party that pretends to cut our taxes. Britain has had 10 named storms since September and that is unprecedented.
 
stanthevan said:
This is the whole point. Both major parties want to appeal to the ostriches. People all over the world are dying in fires and floods. Pollution and famine caused by climate change is rife but hey ho, let’s vote for the party that pretends to cut our taxes. Britain has had 10 named storms since September and that is unprecedented.
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They've only named them since 2015.
 
red_house said:
Loads of Guardian readers can't afford EV's, solar panels and like most don't want to see £28 billion thrown at something that just appears to be trying to appease a so called green credential.

If however Labour had a clear path on what they were doing, where the money was going exactly and what it would achieve then it might make sense to voters. If this already exists can someone point me to it, I'd be genuinely interested.
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£28 billion is nothing if it means we can produce our own energy. We currently give £50 billion a year to fossil fuel producing states and dictators.
 
stanthevan said:
£28 billion is nothing if it means we can produce our own energy. We currently give £50 billion a year to fossil fuel producing states and dictators.
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If only it was that simple. Sadly all of the wind farms in the world won't power 32 million internal combustion engines on our roads or 23 million gas boilers keeping us warm for many, many years. They'll never power aircraft that take people on holiday - you know the good things in life that people work hard for.

As it is there's little incentive to get people into affordable electric vehicles or to change their heating systems without people having to cough up for it big time. Voters aren't stupid and it's the public that vote Governments in.

Even Labour MP's have little idea where the £28 billion was going exactly hence they wanted clarity. I've no issue with Starmer also trying to balance the economy in the process and rightly being worried that to pay for it, the country would slide further into debt.
 
Easy to say whatever and spend hypothetical money when you've no say and are in no position to spend it.

Once in (or in this case on the cusp of) holding power - the bean counters and the civil service will get involved. Someone's had a word in Labour's ear.

To be fair to Labour (even I can do that) the headlines that they've scrapped it all are a tad sensationalist, what they're actually saying is they'll restructure it.

Obviously we'd all want more detail on what when and how. Even Labour MPs have asked those questions. On that point. to quote the BBC
"There have also been complaints about how the policy has landed, with some worried the £28bn figure was better known than what the money would be spent on."

Again details, all part and parcel of actually being in power rather than being in opposition.
 
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Kenya Cherrie said:
They can't invest money the UK doesn't have. They are going to go so deep in debt with all their promises. They need to scrap a few of their plans.
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How did the UK economy ever grow? To get things going you have to invest to an extent. It's not about money we have in the bank, it's about sensible financial planning. Ask any football club.

You also say this like the Tories haven't already invested billions in a bunch of projects that will bring minimal returns (except to their cronies of course). Labour want to emulate this!

And yet Green technology is actually a growth area we could have put that money towards. We have the skills and infrastructure to be world leaders.

The fact that the world is burning should speak for itself, but even the financial argument doesn't make sense.
 
red_house said:
If only it was that simple. Sadly all of the wind farms in the world won't power 32 million internal combustion engines on our roads or 23 million gas boilers keeping us warm for many, many years. They'll never power aircraft that take people on holiday - you know the good things in life that people work hard for.

As it is there's little incentive to get people into affordable electric vehicles or to change their heating systems without people having to cough up for it big time. Voters aren't stupid and it's the public that vote Governments in.

Even Labour MP's have little idea where the £28 billion was going exactly hence they wanted clarity. I've no issue with Starmer also trying to balance the economy in the process and rightly being worried that to pay for it, the country would slide further into debt.
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And we’ll never put a man on the moon.
 
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